On October 8th, 2002, the FDA announced the approval of Subutex and Suboxone tablets for the treatment of opioid dependence. Subutex and Suboxone also became the first narcotic drugs available for the treatment of opioid dependence that could be prescribed in an office setting under the Drug Addiction Treatment Act (DATA) of 2000.
As a result of these changes in policy, many opiate-dependent individuals were now able to be treated with Subutex and Suboxone.
Some people chose to enroll in Opiate Treatment Programs (OTP’s) and received Suboxone in an outpatient treatment setting (which includes counseling), while others opted for treatment under the care of a private physician.
All over the nation, people were getting the help they really needed, and for over 13 years now, Subutex and Suboxone have continued to save lives, careers, homes, marriages, families, and much more.
However, the treatment of opioid dependence with these medications is far from perfect.
Let me explain:
It’s true that a very small minority of individuals are happy with the prospect of staying on these medications for the rest of their lives. However, the vast majority of patients taking Subutex or Suboxone are determined to get off these medications at some point.
For some, their goal is to be off in a few months. Others decide that a few years or more of maintenance therapy is the most effective plan for them.
The Missing Puzzle Pieces
Overall, most doctors have done a good job at treating opioid dependence with these medications. The patient comes in addicted to opiates, the doctor does an examination on them, administers the medication, and within a few hours or less, the patient leaves with minimal to zero opiate withdrawal symptoms and cravings.
Everyone feels great about the situation.
“Win-Win.”
Unfortunately, in many cases, important pieces of the “recovery puzzle” are left out.
As the Subutex or Suboxone “newbie” leaves the office, they are filled with high hopes. Now they just need to take this medication for awhile, then down the road, they can stop and everything will be fine.
Right???
Unfortunately, if I had a nickel every time someone told me their doctor didn’t educate them on just how powerful Subutex or Suboxone really were…well, let’s just say I’d have a very large jar of nickels. And often times, the oversight doesn’t stop there.
Once a patient tells their doctor they are ready to start coming off Subutex or Suboxone, a large percentage of doctors provide the patient with instructions on how to taper their medication, but the education doesn’t go much further.
What usually happens is this:
The patient reaches a point in their taper where they start to feel bad.
They complain of symptoms such as fatigue, depression, anxiety, insomnia, sweating, restlessness, and on and on. The patient becomes confused because they did everything the doctor said, but somehow they still feel horrible, and nobody told them this could happen the first day they signed up for treatment.
In typical cases, the patient is left to fend for themselves, because let’s be honest, most doctors simply aren’t aware of the many natural strategies for reducing Subutex and Suboxone taper symptoms.
Of course, some of the Subutex and Suboxone prescribers are familiar with proper nutrition, exercise, and supplementation for Sub-tapering, but they are the exception, not the rule.
In most cases, the doctor will either tell you it’s not as bad as you’re making it out to be or if you’re lucky, you might get a sympathetic doctor who will prescribe you clonidine and/or other medications.
Suboxone/Subutex Taper Supplements
Now you see what am referring to when I say there are often missing pieces to the “recovery puzzle.”
The two missing elements are typically:
Not enough education upfront, and not a sufficient bio/psycho/social treatment plan when it comes time to taper (the biological or physical aspect of Sub-tapering is often left untreated, or it’s treated in an ineffective way).
The truth is, some people can taper off these medications just fine with the right taper schedule.
However, for the majority of individuals (especially people that have been on Subs for years), a strategic taper protocol alone is insufficient. They need more help, and that is where supplements come along.
After years of research and fine-tuning, I’ve come up with an epic list of supplements that can promote mental and physical health during a Sub-taper. Many people have used these supplements and emailed me to say how well they worked for them.
Here are my Top 11…
1. Solgar DLPA
DL-Phenylalanine, commonly known as DLPA, is a combination amino acid supplement consisting of 50% D-Phenylalanine, and 50% L-Phenylalanine.
This synergistic duo has mega-benefits for people tapering off Subs because supplementing with DLPA can correct biochemical imbalances caused by decreasing opioid blood-concentration levels.
DLPA increases the following neurotransmitters in the brain:
- Endorphins – The body’s natural opium-like painkillers, which become severely deficient in persons tapering off Subs.
- Dopamine – When a person is tapering off Subs, their dopamine levels plummet, which can lead to anhedonia (inability to feel pleasure). Dopamine is responsible for feelings of motivation, pleasure, euphoria, and it plays a large role in the “reward system” in the brain.
- Epinephrine/Norepinephrine – Also known as adrenaline and noradrenaline, these “focus neurotransmitters” can reverse depression, fight fatigue, and help the body respond to the physical and psychological stress induced by a Sub-taper.
Note: DLPA often appears to potentiate pain relief and ease depression in patients receiving opiates for chronic non-malignant pain. What does this mean? If DLPA increases the effects of opiates, this means it is a VERY POWERFUL supplement for tapering.
How to use DLPA on a Sub-Taper
Dr. Charles Gant, author of End Your Addiction Now: The Proven Nutritional Supplement Program That Can Set You Free, recommends using up to 2,000 mg up to three times a day.
My favorite brand is Solgar DLPA, as it is the highest-quality I’ve tried out of several.
Directions: Take 500 mg to start, and work your way up if there are no adverse reactions (such as hypertension). Always take DLPA on an empty stomach 45-60 minutes before meals. Take a maximum of 2,000 mg three times a day (morning, midmorning, and evening).
2. Solgar L-Tyrosine
L-Tyrosine is a non-essential amino acid that is abundant in many high-protein foods such as chicken, turkey, fish, cottage cheese, cheese, yogurt, almonds, milk, avocados, bananas, peanuts, pumpkin seeds, sesame seeds, and soy products.
L-Tyrosine is beneficial for tapering off Subs because it helps your brain produce dopamine, norepinephrine, and epinephrine.
In dopaminergic cells in the brain, L-Tyrosine makes the following conversion:
L-Tyrosine → L-Dopa → Dopamine → Norepinephrine + Epinephrine
When I first used The Thomas Recipe for coming off opiates, I noticed some interesting things:
- Mood Boost – Normally I would be totally depressed coming off opiates. The L-Tyrosine helped to lift the dark clouds of depression.
- Energy Boost – Fatigue is one of the most common symptoms of coming off opiates. This powerful amino acid supplement increased my mental and physical energy.
How to use L-Tyrosine on a Sub-Taper
Again, referencing Dr. Charles Gant, he recommends using up to 2,000 mg up to three times a day. If you’re combining this with DLPA or mucuna, which I will talk about soon, you may wish to use low to moderate doses of each, rather than using the full daily limit of all of them.
Directions: Start off by taking 500 mg of Solgar L-Tyrosine first thing in the morning on an empty stomach, at least 45 minutes before breakfast. If you don’t have any negative reactions, begin increasing your dose by 500 mg each time, with a maximum of 2,000 mg up to three times a day. In the evening, you may wish to skip the dose or lower it as it can cause insomnia if you take it at night.
3. Herb Pharm Passion Flower
Passion flower is a beautiful flowering plant that has a long history of use among Native Americans in North America and European colonists. Throughout history as well as the present day, passion flower has been used to treat a number of health conditions.
Presently, there are around 14 conditions passion flower has been used for, but for the purposes of this article, I will concentrate solely on how it can help ease symptoms caused by reducing your Sub-dosage.
Passion flower has been shown to be helpful for:
- Insomnia
- Gastrointestinal (GI) upset due to narcotic drug withdrawal
- Opiate withdrawal
- Nervousness and excitability
- High blood pressure
- Pain relief
Note: Passion flower can effectively treat depression during a Sub-taper.
Passion flower contains the monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibitors harmaline and harmine. Passion flower also contains several flavonoids that are MAO inhibitors, including apigenin, kaempferol, and quercetin.
MAOs are enzymes that break down neurotransmitters and stop their messaging activity.
Therefore, taking this herb on your Sub-taper can result in an abundance of the following mood-boosting chemicals in the brain:
- Serotonin – Makes you feel emotionally relaxed.
- Norepinephrine – Increases energy, fights fatigue, fights depression, helps the body respond to stress.
- Epinephrine – Increases energy, fights fatigue, fights depression, helps the body respond to stress.
- Dopamine – Responsible for feelings of pleasure and enjoyment in life.
Note: MAO inhibitor medications used to be commonly prescribed to treat depression. Due to their dangerous reactions with certain foods, they have been largely replaced by other types of antidepressants. Taking passion flower for depression on a Sub-taper is much safer because it can inhibit MAO enzymes without the unpleasant side effects of antidepressants.
Passion flower can also effectively treat anxiety and insomnia during opiate withdrawal.
Passion flower increases brain levels of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA). GABA is an inhibitory neurotransmitter that acts as a “mental relaxant.”
Anxiolytic (anti-anxiety) medications in the benzodiazepine class (Valium, Ativan, Klonopin, Xanax, Librium, etc.) work directly on the brain’s GABA receptors, leading to the following effects:
- Reduces anxiety
- Muscle relaxant
- Helps one to fall and stay asleep
Note: These medications can be very beneficial for jumping off Subs, however, do to their high potential for addiction, they should only be used for 3-4 days to ease the worst of the withdrawal symptoms. Also, I know it can be difficult to obtain benzos during a Sub-jump. Fortunately, passion flower can be used as a natural alternative for treating anxiety and insomnia.
Passion Flower for Opiate Withdrawal Study
Clonidine is currently the most widely prescribed medication in the treatment of opiate withdrawal. In a study from 2001, 65 opiate abusers were assigned randomly to two groups. One group received clonidine plus placebo, while the other group received clonidine plus passion flower extract.
The maximum daily dose of clonidine was 0.8 mg in three divided doses, with a fixed daily dose of 60 drops of passion flower extract.
Results:
- Both protocols were equally effective in treating the physical symptoms of withdrawal.
- Researchers observed that the passion flower + clonidine group showed a significant superiority over clonidine alone in the management of mental symptoms.
How to use Passion Flower on a Sub-Taper
There are many ways to use passion flower on a Sub-taper, including capsules of dried herb, infusions, teas, liquid extracts, and tinctures. The study mentioned above used a total daily dose of 60 drops of passion flower extract.
The most powerful way to take an herbal extract is in alcohol, which makes it a “tincture.”
To experience symptoms relief, all you have to do is buy a small bottle of passion flower tincture, squirt some drops into water or any other liquid (taking it straight tastes bad), and consume. My favorite product is Herb Pharm Passion Flower Extract.
Directions: On a Sub-taper, you might not need to take 60 drops per day. Everyone is different, however, and people might benefit from taking anywhere from 20-120 drops a day in 3-4 divided doses.
4. Shen Nong’s Ginseng
The name ginseng refers to any of 11 different species of slow-growing perennial plants with fleshy roots. Ginseng contains many active substances. The substances thought to be most important are called ginsenosides.
High-quality ginseng is unparalleled in its efficacy at neutralizing fatigue.
This is due to its adaptogenic properties. Adaptogens are a class of plants/herbs that, when administered, result in stabilization of physiological functions and facilitation of homeostasis.
Normally, someone on a very low dose of Subs is prone to suffer from a lack of energy for days, weeks, or even months in extreme cases.
Many individuals have to work and/or take care of kids in addition to other responsibilities.
The extreme fatigue from tapering low and jumping off Subs can be a major contributor to people “staying stuck” on medication.
Often they can’t just stop going to work and taking care of children because they don’t feel good. Thus, it can be easy to stay stuck on Subs, and some people even jump off Subs then start using again…and the cycle continues.
This is where adaptogenic herbs can help.
Here are some amazing benefits for you to review, Adaptogens:
- Improve the health of your adrenal system.
- Help strengthen the body’s response to stress.
- Enhance the body’s ability to cope with anxiety and fight fatigue.
- Calm you down and boost your energy at the same time without overstimulating.
- Normalize body imbalances.
Note: Adaptogens promote the facilitation of homeostasis in the body. They’re called adaptogens because of their unique ability to “adapt” their function according to your body’s specific needs. Though the effects may initially be subtle and take time to make themselves felt, they’re real and undeniable.
*Adaptogens work a bit like a thermostat. When the thermostat senses that the room temperature is too high it brings it down; when the temperature is too low it brings it up.
How to use Ginseng on a Sub-Taper
Ginseng is the quintessential adaptogenic herb. A randomized, double-blind study from 2010 showed that high doses of American ginseng over two months reduced cancer-related fatigue in patients more effectively than a placebo. Using this herb on a Sub-taper can help to give you a much-needed energy boost in a way that nothing else can.
With this herb, you don’t want to just get the regular stuff sold at a health food store. You really need to use something that is VERY HIGH QUALITY.
Shen Nong’s Ginseng is a premium extract that provides the body with a TON OF ENERGY, adaptability, health, and vitality.
Directions: Take 1-3 droppers as needed 2-3 times per day. Drink it on an empty stomach with a full glass of water.
5. Himalaya Mucuna
Mucuna pruriens, also known as “velvet bean” and other less common names, is a tropical legume native to Africa and Asia. It contains levodopa (L-dopa), which converts to the chemical dopamine in the brain.
Dopamine is a neurotransmitter that promotes enjoyment and interest in life.
It also increases mental focus, motivation, and feelings of pleasure. Addiction destroys the pleasure/reward center in the brain. That’s one of the reasons why Sub-tapers are so hard to deal with. The dopamine deficiency can cause anhedonia (inability to feel pleasure) and other psychological symptoms.
Fortunately, mucuna can help re-supply your brain with this neurotransmitter that is essential to opiate addiction treatment.
Taking this herb on a Sub-taper can provide the following benefits:
- Treats insomnia and deepens sleep
- Reverses depression
- Powerful mood-booster
- Helps the body respond to stress and fatigue
- Decreases opioid cravings
Note: In a study from 2010, it was concluded that mucuna pruriens helps in reducing psychological stress.
How to use Mucuna on a Sub-Taper
Mucuna is truly one of my favorite supplements for Sub-tapering. Himalaya Mucuna is a very good product that is affordable, while also containing a very high percentage of L-Dopa in each capsule.
This is the brand I now use after trying about six different formulas.
Directions: Start out by taking one tablet first thing in the morning on an empty stomach, at least 45 minutes before breakfast. If you do well on it, increase the dose to a maximum of 2-3 tablets 2-3 times a day.
6. MacaForce
Maca root powder has a long history of being a safe superfood and adaptogen, which has been consumed for its medicinal benefits for thousands of years in regions of the Andes Mountains. The main action of maca root is to strengthen endurance and energy levels, making it very useful on a Sub-taper.
Maca is widely used to promote the sexual function of both men and women.
Many athletes take maca for peak performance and stamina.
Furthermore, if you find yourself overcome with anxiety, stress, depression, or mood swings, maca may help alleviate these symptoms.
Directions: Mix 1 tablespoon MacaForce into a glass of water first thing in the morning on an empty stomach and consume.
7. Raw Reishi
Reishi mushroom has been revered as perhaps the most sought-after and valuable adaptogen in Traditional Chinese Medicine for over 2,000 years.
Along with ginseng and many others herbs, reishi is known as a “tonic herb.”
Tonic herbs are substances considered so fundamental and important to overall health, vitality, and quality of life that they are encouraged to be taken daily for their numerous benefits, sick or not.
Whereas ginseng is more known for it’s energy-enhancing and fatigue-fighting benefits, reishi also comes with its own unique abilities. Since it’s an adaptogen, it can certainly increase natural energy, however, what I love most about this mushroom is reishi’s ability to enhance mood.
Reishi is a powerful “Shen tonic,” which translates loosely to an herb that “nourishes the spirit.”
Here is a list of some popular reishi benefits:
- Helps to conquer depression.
- Calms the mind and induces a state of relaxed focus.
- Boosts the immune system.
- Improves cardiovascular function.
- Accelerates the clearance of drugs and chemicals that the liver stores.
- Relaxes the nervous system.
Note: A multicenter, double-blind, randomized, placebo-controlled trial was conducted in China. 5.4 grams of reishi daily was administered for 8 weeks, resulting in a reduction of fatigue.
How to use Reishi on a Sub-Taper
Reishi has truly changed my life. This stuff makes me totally euphoric. When I take it, I feel relaxed, blissed out, and connected to the whole universe. I’ve taken a ton of different supplements, and this is one I will be using daily for the rest of my life.
I simply cannot recommend it enough.
Directions: Take 1-3 droppers of Raw Reishi up to 1-3 times a day as needed. Drink it on an empty stomach with a full glass of water. Reishi and other tonic herbs usually need to be taken daily for a week or two before the most significant benefits manifest. But once they do, you are in for quite a pleasant surprise! Enjoy 🙂
8. Top Extracts Kava Kava Root
Kava kava, also known simply as kava, is a plant that is native to the Western Pacific. Kava is widely consumed throughout Pacific Ocean cultures of Polynesia for its sedative (calming) and anesthetic (painkilling) properties.
Kava has the rare ability to induce relaxation while simultaneously improving mental clarity and cognitive function.
Cultures throughout the Pacific have a great respect for kava and hold it in the highest regard. These Pacific cultures frequently hold kava ceremonies, which often accompany important political, religious, and social functions.
Many individuals have used this herb while tapering off Subs. The active ingredients in kava are known as kavalactones.
These substances induce effects similar to alcohol, such as:
- Relaxation
- Talkativeness
- Euphoria
The kavalactones in kava contain the following properties:
- Anxiolytic (anti-anxiety)
- Analgesic (painkilling)
- Muscle Relaxing
- Anticonvulsant (anti-seizure)
How to use Kava Kava on a Sub-Taper
Using kava on a Sub-taper is very simple. You can use kava tea, kava capsules, kava tinctures, kava extracts, etc. My favorite product is Top Extracts Kava 70%. It’s a very reputable company with extremely high-quality products.
I’ve used it several times, and I give it my stamp of approval.
Directions: Start off with a 1/4 teaspoon Top Extracts Kava 70% in a glass of water, milk, or juice. If that doesn’t do the trick, up the dose to 1/2 or even 1 teaspoon. Use it a few times a day as needed to ameliorate symptoms.
9. NatureWise 5-HTP
5-Hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP) is a naturally occurring amino acid and chemical precursor in the biosynthesis of the neurotransmitters serotonin and melatonin from tryptophan.
5-HTP is a chemical by-product of the protein building block L-Tryptophan.
It is also produced commercially from the seeds of an African plant (Griffonia simplicifolia). 5-HTP works in the brain and central nervous system (CNS) by increasing the production of the chemical serotonin.
Serotonin can affect:
- Sleep
- Appetite
- Temperature
- Sexual behavior
- Pain sensation
Since 5-HTP increases the synthesis of serotonin, it is used for many conditions where serotonin is believed to play an important role.
Here are just a few common examples:
- Insomnia
- Anxiety
- Migraines
- PMS
- Obesity
- Depression
- Opiate withdrawal
- Sub-Taper
How to use 5-HTP on a Sub-Taper
Taking 5-HTP on a Sub-taper may lead to decreased symptoms of depression, anxiety, and insomnia. I’ve known many people on Sub-tapers that stated 5-HTP helped them reduce their dose with fewer symptoms.
Directions: Take 1 capsule NatureWise 5-HTP with food 1-3 times a day.
10. Opiate Withdrawal Formula
Opiate Withdrawal Formula is a powerful supplement that was specifically formulated for people coming off opioid drugs. It contains a powerful and synergistic blend of amino acids, herbs, vitamins, minerals, and other nutrients that promote physical and mental health during a Sub-taper.
The Opiate Withdrawal Supplement promotes the following benefits:
- Enhances Mood
- Promotes healthy digestion and appetite
- Increases natural energy and focus
- Calms anxiety
- Restores dopamine, GABA, and serotonin production quickly
- Relieves depression
- Reduces insomnia and helps you get more restorative sleep
11. General Wellness Supplements
The first 11 supplements I wrote about are all specific for alleviating certain symptoms on a Sub-taper.
However, it’s also very beneficial to take some general wellness supplements that can also promote physical and mental health while your body is going through a hard transition off medication.
The following list of supplements can create a solid foundation of health:
- For men, take 1 tablet Rainbow Light Men’s Multivitamin daily with breakfast. For women, take 1 tablet Rainbow Light Women’s Multivitamin daily with breakfast.
- Truly Natural Vitamin C – 1.5 teaspoons 3 times a day with or without food.
- Nordic Naturals DHA – 2 softgels a day with food.
- Solgar B-Complex 100 – Take 1 capsule a day with breakfast.
- Solgar Calcium/Magnesium/Zinc – Take 3 tablets daily with dinner.
That’s a lot of Sub-Taper Supplements!
If you’re feeling overwhelmed, don’t worry, because so am I!!! Of course, you don’t need to take all of these supplements to get results, but you knew that, right?
That would actually be unhealthy.
If it were me doing the Sub-taper, I would start off with the general wellness supplements. Then when I started to feel symptoms from lowering my dose, I would either take several of the nutrients from 1-9, or I would just take the Opiate Withdrawal Supplement.
These formulas both contain so many things I probably wouldn’t need to add much other stuff…maybe 1-3 other supplements from the 1-9 list at most.
Using a strategic blend of supplements on your Sub-taper can be an effective part of your bio/psycho/social treatment plan.
Make sure to focus on eating healthy foods, drink plenty of water, exercise on a regular basis, and get to bed before 11:00 pm the majority of the time for maximum results.
And don’t forget about Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome (PAWS). To ensure that you feel your best after making your Sub-jump, continue to take supplements for at least 3-6 months. After that, you can get by on taking less, or even none if your nutrition and exercise are very solid.
If you have any questions, please feel free to post them in the comment box below, and good luck to you. 🙂
Brook Heath
Hey! I’m currently tapering off Suboxone & just wanted to throw out a supplement that not only works for me, but has worked for others as well: Genius Joy: which has a LOT of the ingredients mentioned above + Genius Mushrooms (includes Reishi) as a topper to further help!! I’m down to 4.5mgs so far from 8mgs starting March 13th & don’t feel all that bad at all. Not yet anyways. I’m definitely going to look into some of the other supplements, especially those for energy + nausea!
Candace
Thank u for all the valuable info. I have bought the mag calcium and zinc and I’ve bought the b complex but not sure if they are ok to take together or with my other prescription medications, can u help?
Nicole
Thanks for all the info. Can you recommend a Ginseng extract that might be a little cheaper? I also didn’t see what brand of Kava you have used, hoping you can recommend one of those also. I’m a bit untrusting of some of the supplement brands these days. I do like the Solgar you recommended. I’m doing a slow taper off suboxone and just can’t afford to “slack off” having a small child. Thanks again for writing all of this out for others.
Matt Finch
My pleasure! And yes, there is another brand I recommend that is less expensive and still great, but it’s not as good. Still, it’s much better than almost all other ginsengs. Here is a link to it:
Dragon Herbs House Ginseng>>
Susan
I have been on Suboxone (2 8mg/2mg tablets)for almost 9 years..currently I am trying to taper on my own as my doctor does not want to help me taper with any supplements and I know that I will need them My question is would the calm support or the elimidrol work best and can either be taken with the mushrooms you mentioned. I am a 65 year old woman and very tired. I have managed to get down to 1/2 over 7 months but seem stuck at the 1/2 tablet. Can you please advise what would work best at this point for me. As stated..very tired..no energy..alot of anxiety as well as depression, no appetite..stomach I, etc.
Desiree
Thank you for the supplement advice. I’ve been on opiates for 6 months st high doses. My last opiate was almost 2 Sundays ago. Today is Thursday. I’ve been taking subutex 4-8 mg a day since last Tuesday. I hate it! I feel like a zombie. I need my ability to function. Should I stop taking subutex and start all of these supplements immediately or taped off subutex slowly while adding the supplements? Thank you
Matt Finch
Hi Desiree,
If you feel like a zombie, your dose is likely not right. A doctor would likely adjust your dose lower until you feel less sedated. Talk to your doctor about this, and if it were me I would start taking some of the supplements right away, with your doctors permission of course.
Lisa
Mike
Hi, my name is Lisa. I’m a nurse from SC, and I have been fighting addiction for almost 15 years. Fortunately, I am one of the subutex taper success stories and I am now 5 years clean and sober. I am so sorry to hear that yours having so many problems from this medicine.
Before I say anything else, please understand that I am not a doctor anf I hope no one sues me or takes my advice and gets hurt. So please check with a doctor first before you do anything that ANYONE tells you to.
Now, you say you are taking Suboxone. What form? Pills? Film? Is it brand name or generic? Which route do you use to take it? Are you taking it sublingually? What time of day do you take it? How long are you letting it rest under your tongue?
I have been told that some people spit out the built up saliva when taking their medicine as this can help prevent some side effects from the Narcan. Obviously, this is not really a great idea because you won’t be able to be sure that you’re getting the full amount. Also, are you taking it at least 30 minutes after you eat/drink/ smoke? (Idk if you smoke I just included that in case you do. If you don’t, then just disregard. )
Are you drinking any detox tea along with this med? This can make it not work as well. Also, what type of withdrawal symptoms are you feeling? If it’s nausea, I would have thought your Nabilone would have taken care if that. If it’s anxiety, I would think that your Lorazepam isn’t right. Are you experiencing the crawly feeling? RLS? Chills? Fever? Also, before you started this medicine, what was your DOC (Drug of choice)? Did you shoot it? You may want to go to the doctor if so. I thought what I was experiencing was withdrawals but it turned out that I had developed an infection in my heart from shooting up. I had to have a valve replaced. I’m not trying to scare you, but there may be other reasons the meds aren’t working besides them just not being enough.
I guess what I’m saying is, I need to know more. I have never heard of anyone taking that many mg’s of Suboxone or subutex daily without getting relief. I feel like there is probably something else going on with you.
Now, and I have to mention this, if you’re looking to feel as good as you did on drugs, you probably won’t. No matter what dose you take, subs are just different. They aren’t pure opiate agonists. Some people do take Suboxone to get high. If you are not trying to feel high, I sincerely apologize but I had to get that out there. Other people will read this too.
Similarly, you may still crave some drugs for years after stopping them… Even while taking subutex. I was not only addicted to opiates, I also loved to shoot coke. I’ve been 5 years clean and sober now and I still crave coke at times. So if it’s the cravings that you’re experiencing, the best thing to do, is get outside yourself. Quickly start thinking of something else. Anything else. Get up and do something. An activity. Do something for someone else. Even if you just walk around the house and focus on the clouds or the bricks on the side of a building. Any time, you feel the cravings start, MAKE yourself think about something else.
If you’re dealing with the restless legs, the crawly skin, the hot chills and the cold sweats, you may have an adrenal disorder. This can be caused by or at least brought out by doing drugs for lengthy periods. Also, your body may just be entirely depleted of vitamins. Try taking Vitamin D and Super B Complex. I took some pretty high doses of that (first thing in the morning) and I found that it really helped. Also, clonidine can help you transition but you will have to go to your doctor about that.
Even after 4 years of subutex, I would still experience yawns and sneezes at times. That just takes a while for body to get it all straightened out.
If it’s back pain, you may have that forever. I know several people who experienced severe back pain after opiate addiction though they never experienced back pain prior to drug use.
I’m sorry, I’m kind of tired right now and I can’t think of any other withdrawal symptoms that drove me out of my mind (Lol! See, theres some good news! Eventually this will all be a fading memory!) but if you message me back, I would like to help. I’ll keep checking on here to see if you respond.
Best of luck to you! I hope everything works out for you soon! Please don’t relapse? You’ve come too far!
Best Wishes
Lisa
Julian
Hey Lisa I admire your will and strength best of a your testimony I once was addicted to pills for a while and now I’m addicted to Suboxone and I want so bad to get off I’ve been on 8mg for almost two years I take one a day I use to take two but I’m down to one for months I tried to go cold turkey but I can’t deal with the withdrawals mainly the anxiety I get so scared from then and it turns to a real bad panic attack I start to feel like OMG I’m die but for my kids I have to come off I hate being so dependent on something that means me no good I have no one to talk to so on top of that I get so depress I want to taper off and when I said I am once I get them I don’t but this time I’m so serious I’m also in the process of quitting cigarettes the two is my only habits not that it’s different from any other addiction I stay with low iron Etcc just please any advice a do thank you and may God continue to keep you strong on your journey
Beth
JULIAN, if I were to write a response her this is exactly what I would have said. EXACTLY. I also take 8mg and am terrified of the withdrawal etc. I dont have any downtime from caring for my large family to oush through the sypmtoms and my biggest wish is to be SUB FREE.
Mike Bernard
I am presently on suboxone at 18 mg a day. I have been as high as 26 mg. I started out at 8 mg for 1 day then 1/ mg for 2 days then 14 mg for 2 days then 18 mg for 14 days then 22 mg for 7 days then 24 mg for 7 days then 26 mg for 7 days then 20 mg for 7 days and now 18 mg for 7 days. PLEASE HELP ME At every level I have had NO relief at all. No comfort zone no “sweet spots” NOTHING. I continue to be in withdrawal 24/7. Does this drug ever work at any level??? I am taking 4 mg of lorazepam, 6 gms of Nabilone, 500 gms of Gabapentin, and 30 mg of symbalta . I am looking for answers on this Dilema.. The withdrawals are unbelievable, I’m not far from jumping off a cliff. ANY HELP would be greatly appreciated.
Dave
I once read comments similar to yours from a young man complaining in a forum that the Suboxone he was taking was just not working. After other people read his comments someone finally thought to ask him exactly how he was taking the medicine. He replied that since he was given tablets he was swallowing them. After all, isn’t that how you always consume tablet medication? Of course Suboxone (brand), Subutex (brand), buprenorphine (generic) tablets are to be consumed sublingually, i.e. under the tongue. So…are you taking your Suboxone sublingually? I can’t think of any other reason why Suboxone would not be working for you to reduce/eliminate opiate withdrawal symptoms. I’ve been on Suboxone for 14 years now at 12mg/day, and it works for me every day.
Eduardo
Hi Matt, I’m not sure if you still reply to this or not, you may be too busy.
So after 3 years of heavy pill use I was placed on 16mg of suboxone. At the time I had no idea it was an addiction in itself. I have now been on it for 2 years. About 6 months ago I had realized i had enough I want my life back. I have slowly started a taper in which I feel pretty good, but my main issue is the restless legs and arms. Which I had even at higher doses of subs but all started after pill use stopped. I feel my dopamine levels are extremely low possibly or my body just isn’t producing. It’s horrible, I’m ok after a dose for a few hours but in between doses it gets so bad I can barely drive to and from work as its at its worse when I’m still. I was wondering what supplements you recommend I take to focus on this problem. I have purchased mucuna but wasn’t sure if I could take it while still taking suboxone. Are there any interactions you know of between the two and what else other than mucunu should I take as I lower it and head towards the jump. I plan to jump at 1mg and try kratom for 2 weeks then taper from that. I had a friend that had great success using kratom learn for 2 weeks and then tapering from it. She said she had little to no withdrawals at all. I also take a very low dose Xanax which is another demon I’ll have to attack after I’m in the clear, so whatever I take would have to be safe with this also. I hope to hear from you as I feel confident I can get thru this if I can figure out how to deal with the rls.. Thank you kindly eduardo
Mary Price - Certified OAS Recovery Specialist
Edwardo,
First, have some blood work done to see what nutrients (minerals, vitamins) you are lacking. Low magnesium and potassium are two main things that contribute to rls as well.
Have a PKU test done (this was just brought to my attention by another reader who has PKU and found out that certain dopamine producing supplements are harmful for him).
Mucuuna pruriens is what I used, along with dlpa (dl-phenylalanine), while I tapered from suboxone. I also took a good multi-vitamin to make sure that I received the cofactor nutrients to aid dopamine production. I had no bad side effects, actually I felt so much better. I started it at about 8MG during the taper.
1mg is still a pretty high dose. There is a taper calculator that I like, however I think it is for a quick taper. It’s a good guide for dosing, but I think it’s way too quick and should be extended; especially when it gets to small doses. At the lowest dose I found that skipping days once you’ve adjusted to the dose worked best; first one day then two and so on. Waiting until you’ve adjusted can sometimes be uncomfortable but that’s why the preparation with the right supplements is important. http://www.helpmegetoffdrugs.com/taper
As for kratom, I don’t know if you know this or not but it has become and issue where the FDA is trying to make it illegal by scheduling it . If they get their way, kratom will be illegal to purchase and possess. This may happen by the end of the month. Imo, just another “knee-jerk” reaction by our federal government who knows nothing about something but is allowing the lobbyists from Big Pharmacy control the laws so that they can benefit! Grrrr…….?
~Mary
OAS RECOVERY SPECIALIST
Kalya
Hi Matt!
Thank you for all you have done and all the information you provide to us! I’ve been on oxy’s for 10 years or so. I’ve had enough. ENOUGH!
Last week I started buprenorphine. My last oxy was last Saturday. Sunday I started with 8mg of bup. Monday & Tuesday I took 8mg each day. Wednesday 6mg, Thursday 6mgs, Friday 4mgs. Saturday I woke up dizzy dizzy. I stayed in the house Saturday & Sunday with dizziness everytime I moved my head or eyes too quickly. I did not take any bup on Saturday or Sunday. So today is Monday and I felt a little weird this morning, so I took just 1mg so far today. I still have about 20% of the dizziness lingering.
I have fully committed to stopping opiates ASAP. I can tell you that I’ve tried it all. Including 2 Iboga flood doses in Mexico. Nothing has helped. I’ve always went right back to pain pills. This time I am fully committed to being substance free. This includes bup.
I want to take buprenorphine for as little as possible. I’ve been researching taping schedules, but I don’t think I want to take these for more than 14-20 days.
What do you think? I am functioning at work today with just a little bit of dizziness, but I don’t think it is related to my meds.
I was thinking of taking the bup for getting over withdrawals from the opiates and that’s all.
Any advice you have for me would be greatly appreciated!
Best,
Kayla
Matt Finch
You’re very welcome Kayla! And as for you question: In my experience, people that are VERY motivated to quit have been able to use Suboxone for short duration like the time you mentioned. Your full commitment will help you achieve your goal! Also, make sure to read the following article:
How To Taper Off Suboxone Like a Champion
I know you have it in you to do anything you want!
Ashley
Hi. This is Ashley I have been on Suboxone for five years and I will be the first to tell you that you are making the biggest mastake of your live getting on Suboxone because today is my 13th day clean off them and I came off them cold turkey but I’m still having cravings and have no energy. I would rather take three to four days to come off an opiate then to take months to come off Suboxone you are making a mistake but I wish u the best.
Anonymous
Hi Ashley!!
Thanks for your reply! I totally get where you’re coming from as I have read many many stories like yours.
That is the main reason I have switched back and forth from subs to oxys.
Today is my first day off of subutex. I was back on it for the last 5 days. I’ve never taken it more than 40 days at one time and that was in the beginning (like 9 months ago). During the last few months I’ve mostly taken oxys….
congrats on you being 13th days off!! I hope you get your groove back asap!!
Best to you….
eric
Hi Ashley..
I was in the same boat and the same amt of time on this poison called
suboxone.. I hv been off for 19 days. I am having issues with sleep as in my eyes Don’t feel heavy and my brain seem unresponsive to sleep med both over the counter and prescription..
Every time i would ask this so called . psychiatrist pain mgmt dr ” is this safe to take because it help with my back pain?.. He would say YES YES YES of course its safe.. well i say LIAR LIAR LIAR.! So my advice is … (with the exception of saving a life or chronic user)
Plse plse don’t stay on for longer then a week or 2.. As research shows that it depletes Andenosine in the brain which is primary for sleep.. These so called docs who run these in and out clinics and grab money form u and commission fro the makers of this umm poison..
They hide behind the notion that they are noble and saving lives .. AH ha i say to them maybe so but no everyone is the same.. Can you tell me if your sleep has been non existent and or please tell me it get bk to normal and any advice is appreciated ..
God Blees.. 🙂
Gilbert Nieto
Hi Matt, don’t know if you remember me, I was a client at crc. I really appreciate the help and encouragement you gave me back then. I am finally close to being done, going down one mg/wk, on thursdays, this Thursday I’ll be down to 7mg. It’s methadone, not suboxone. So I’m feeling no energy and my stomach, especially in the morning, is agitated, like nervous buzzing with burning. Are there natural supplements that really work. Well besides my whining, I hope you and your daughter are doing well and staying happy. Wishing you well, Gilbert