I’m constantly searching for high-quality, natural opiate withdrawal remedies at a good price. A few weeks ago, I sampled some products from a new company that BLEW MY MIND.
TopExtracts.com has not only passed my rigorous testing methods, but I’ve even become a RAVING FAN and loyal customer for life. There are many reasons why I’m such a huge fan, and I’ll be sure to list all of the pros, as well as the cons of using Top Extracts products for opiate withdrawal.
In this article, I’m going to review the following Top Extracts products: Classic Red Bali Kratom, White Vein Borneo Kratom, Kali Super Green Kratom, Kava Extract, and Passion Flower Extract.
Furthermore, you’ll find sections at the end of each product review that outlines how to use it for opiate withdrawal. Thus, after reading this entire article, you will have some GREAT new options for decreasing your opiate withdrawal symptoms naturally.
Kratom Overview
Before I start reviewing different kratom strains, let me give you a little background on the plant. Kratom is an evergreen tree native to Southeast Asia and is a member of the coffee family.
Currently, kratom is not regulated by the Drug Enforcement Agency in the United States (making it legal). Kratom is NOT AN OPIATE. Kratom, simply put, is an opioid agonist.
This is just a fancy term meaning that it mimics the effects of opioid drugs such as:
- Heroin
- Morphine
- Hydrocodone
- Oxycodone
You’ve probably heard of the following medications:
- Methadone
- Suboxone
- Subutex
Note: These are also opioid agonists, and they tend to eliminate opiate withdrawal symptoms and cravings especially well. The only problem is that many individuals are now stuck on these POWERFUL MEDICATIONS, due to them being a lot harder to come off than one might think.
Mitragynine
Mitragynine, the major alkaloid in kratom, is a partial opioid agonist producing similar effects to morphine. An interesting minor alkaloid of kratom, 7-hyrdoxymitragynine, has been reported to be more potent than morphine.
Both kratom alkaloids activate supraspinal mu- and delta- opioid receptors, which is the main reason the plant alleviates withdrawal symptoms so well.
To sum things up, kratom is not an opiate, however, it binds to the same opioid receptors that drugs such as oxycodone, hydrocodone, heroin, methadone, and Suboxone bind to. Thus, kratom is a legal plant that can stop opiate withdrawal within minutes.
Kratom Risks and Effects
I will warn you with a good dose of caution, however, that many individuals are addicted to kratom. If you take too much for too long, it can even cause a horrible withdrawal syndrome very similar to opiate withdrawal.
People can develop addictions to kratom because the effects can be quite nice, and though I’ve never become addicted to it while testing different strains and dosages, I can see why many people abuse it.
Kratom effects include the following:
- Euphoria
- Pain Relief
- Sedation
- Mood-enhancement
- Mental stimulation
Note: The kratom effects vary depending on the strain and dosage used. For instance, lower dosages in the 2-6 gram range could produce stimulating effects, while higher dosages of 7-10 grams or more can lead to more pain relief and sedation.
*Furthermore, the red kratom strains tend to be the most sedating, while the white strains are typically more stimulating. The green strains are typically not as stimulating as white strains, and not as sedating as red ones, and fall somewhere in the middle of the two.
Biochemical Uniqueness
There are many different strains of kratom to choose from. Kratom has become extremely popular, and there is an abundance of different strains available online and in smoke shops. As I previously mentioned, different strains have different effects.
Along with this, each human being has their own individual biochemical makeup.
Thus, the same kratom strain and dosage might make one person feel ABSOLUTELY AMAZING, while it could make another person sick to their stomach. There really is no way to know how you will respond to a particular strain or dosage until you try it.
Mixing Kratom Strains
After learning that many individuals mix kratom strains, I decided to try it out. The results were WONDERFUL. I have generally found the white strains by themselves to be too stimulating for me.
I have also found the red strains by themselves to be too sedating, making it hard to stay motivated throughout the day.
The solution?
I started experimenting with different combinations, and have determined that I respond best to a mixture of 70% white strain, and 30% red strain. This gives me mental stimulation, energy, a significant mood-boost, relaxation, pain relief, and euphoria.
Note: I generally don’t care for the green strains, as they seem to give me anxiety for whatever reason. Even when I mix it with other strains, it’s just not my cup of tea. However, many individuals respond favorably to it.
Top Extracts Review
Now that you have a little background on kratom, we can move on to my reviews of the high-quality strains available at TopExtracts.com. But before I do that, I will first share my experiences with the company.
I started corresponding with the owner Jim via email, as I needed many questions answered about his company and products. Jim is a great guy, and I can tell that he’s TRULY FOCUSED on providing the highest-quality products at a great price, while also delivering superb customer service.
The website is kind of plain, but it’s professional, and most importantly the navigation and ease-of-ordering is spot-on.
After making a purchase, the products were shipped quickly, and they arrived in two days via USPS Priority Mail. The Top Extracts products came in really cool packaging…and I LOVE cool packaging!
After sampling three kratom strains, kava extract, and passion flower extract, I had some GREAT experiences, and now the time has come for me to share them with you. 🙂
Oh, and p.s., Jim was nice enough to offer any readers of this article a 15% discount on your first purchase by using a special promo code.
—>Click here and use this promo code: Welcome Friends
1. Classic Red Bali Kratom
The Red Bali was definitely the best red veined kratom strain I’ve ever tried. I started off by taking two teaspoons mixed into a glass of water.
The Buzz
The Red Bali had me nodding out on the couch, and my girlfriend looked at me and said: “wow, that stuff looks like it works well for you.” She was right.
Though it was not exactly like an “opiate nod,” I would say it was about 90% similar.
A major complaint I have with all strains of kratom, however, is that I crave horrible food once the opioid-like effects come on. I usually eat very healthily, but once the kratom kicks in, I’m headed to get either ice cream, pizza, or a cheeseburger with fries and soda!
How To Use Red Bali Kratom For Opiate Withdrawal
Classic Red Bali would be an EXCELLENT strain to use during the opiate withdrawal syndrome. While going through acute withdrawal, mix one teaspoon into a cup of water or juice and consume on an empty stomach. If that still isn’t enough to eliminate your symptoms, take another teaspoon.
You’re trying to find your ideal dose.
Depending on your addiction severity and individual biochemistry, you might only need one teaspoon a couple of times per day, or you could need three teaspoons several times per day, etc. Below is a picture of the Classic Red Bali Kratom.
Note: The Classic Red Bali runs out from time to time. If this happens, the Kali Red Horn Kratom is a very nice substitute with similar effects.
2. White Vein Borneo Kratom
I was TOTALLY SURPRISED when I tested the White Vein Borneo. Since it is a white strain, I was expecting it to be very stimulating, especially since my first dose was in the stimulating range (I took about 5 grams).
To my amazement, however, I didn’t get my usual mental surge of energy and enthusiasm from a white vein. What I did get was a nice, relaxing, mood-boosting, warm, and mellow high. It was SO SMOOTH, and it mixed extremely well with my biochemistry. 😎
How To Use White Vein Borneo For Opiate Withdrawal
White Vein Borneo could work VERY WELL at relieving withdrawal symptoms. You might even want to mix it with the Classic Red Bali to make it more sedating. While going through acute withdrawal, mix one teaspoon into a cup of water or juice and consume on an empty stomach.
If that still isn’t enough to eliminate your symptoms, take another teaspoon.
If the taste is too gross, consider putting the kratom powder into capsules. It’s time-consuming, but you certainly won’t taste it while using this method of consumption.
Depending on your addiction severity and individual biochemistry, you might only need one teaspoon a couple of times per day, or you could need three teaspoons several times per day, etc. Below is a picture of the White Vein Borneo Kratom.
3. Kali Super Green Kratom
As I predicted, the Kali Super Green was a bit too stimulating for me. I tried it several times, ranging from 1-2 teaspoons, and it was difficult for me to relax on the green vein kratom. I totally expected this, because every other green strain I’ve tried has either given me anxiety, made me agitated, or both.
I messed up and used all of the Classic Red Bali and White Vein Borneo by the time I got to testing the Kali Super Green. I believe if I would’ve mixed the green with the red, this could’ve been a great match, however, that’s not how things played out.
I should mention that I did have an absolutely incredible experience using two teaspoons of the Kali Super Green.
I took my girlfriend and daughter to the beach on a super-hot and BEAUTIFUL day. The water was warm, the sun was shining bright, and I got some good endorphins flowing from swimming and catching waves! This helped to relax me on the Kali Super Green, and I ended up having an extraordinary beach day.
How To Use Kali Super Green For Opiate Withdrawal
During opiate withdrawal, an individual experiences SERIOUS ANXIETY and restlessness. For this reason, I don’t recommend using the Kali Super Green by itself…because it’s just too stimulating, and you want something to relax you.
However, another symptom of opiate withdrawal is EXTREME FATIGUE.
Thus, using too much of a sedating dosage and strain of kratom might make it impossible to go to work, watch the kids, and take care of other important responsibilities.
To balance this, mixing Kali Super Green with some Classic Red Bali could be something you want to consider. I’ve read on many forums that people prefer mixing stimulating and sedating kratom strains to get the best opiate withdrawal symptom relief. Below is a picture of the Kali Super Green.
Additional Tips on Using Kratom
- 1) The effects of kratom can be increased by consuming it with a glass of white grapefruit juice. This acts as a “potentiator,” and I’ve had good experiences in the past experimenting with this. I’ve found that for me, it makes the effects come on stronger and last longer.
- 2) Don’t use kratom for longer than 7-14 days for a cold-turkey withdrawal. Know that the longer you use kratom, the harder it will be to come off, as it is still a powerful drug.
- 3) A common question I get is “will I start off on Day 1 of opiate withdrawal when I stop using kratom?” If you only use kratom for 7-14 days, while tapering your dosage (decreasing amount every 1-2 days), you will still have withdrawal symptoms, though they will be much milder than a cold-turkey withdrawal coming off more powerful drugs such as heroin, oxycodone, hydrocodone, Suboxone, methadone, etc.
- 4) I HIGHLY RECOMMEND using an Opiate Withdrawal Supplement in addition to kratom. This powerful opiate withdrawal supplement can help you come off kratom with ease if you use the guidelines in Tip 3 above.
- If you can afford it, I also highly recommend taking this awesome supplement, because the benefits are just too good to pass up.
- 5) Exercising while using kratom and coming off kratom is one of the best things you can do to alleviate withdrawal symptoms.
- 6) A soak in a jacuzzi or hot bath should also be used daily to relax the nervous system and ease muscle pain and restlessness. I have an outdoor jacuzzi under the trees that I soaked in after taking 7.5 grams of the Classic Red Bali Kratom…It was HEAVEN ON EARTH….soooo relaxing and pain-relieving; the perfect opiate withdrawal remedy.
4. Kava 70% Kavalactones Extract
Kava is a plant that is native to the Western Pacific. It is widely consumed throughout Pacific Ocean cultures of Polynesia for its sedative (calming) and anesthetic (painkilling) properties.
Kava has the rare ability to induce relaxation while simultaneously improving mental clarity and cognitive function.
Cultures throughout the Pacific have a great respect for kava and hold it in the highest regard. These Pacific cultures frequently hold kava ceremonies, which often accompany important political, religious, and social functions. The picture below shows a ceremony where a man is preparing kava in a “kava bowl.”
The Buzz
I’ve tried a few different types of kava over the past year since I started experimenting with it. My first experience was inhaling it out of a vaporizer, and I REALLY liked the buzz. Next, I tried tea, then 30% extract capsules.
They were OK, but nothing like the vaporizer. And now, after trying the Top Extracts Kava with 70% kavalactones, I finally know why it’s so widely consumed throughout Pacific Ocean cultures of Polynesia…it’s INCREDIBLE!!!
Why does kava with such a high percentage of kavalactones work so well? Kavalactones are the active mood-enhancing compounds, and 70% is VERY HIGH. Below is a picture of Kava 70% Kavalactones Extract.
These kavalactones induce effects similar to alcohol such as:
- Relaxation
- Talkativeness
- Euphoria
Note: However, unlike alcohol, kava induces these effects while still maintaining mental clarity in the user.
The kavalactones in kava contain the following properties:
- Anxiolytic (anti-anxiety)
- Analgesic (painkilling)
- Muscle relaxing
- Anticonvulsant (anti-seizure)
My Experience With Top Extracts Kava Extract 70%
The first night I took the Kava with 70% kavalactones in it, I think I fell in LOVE. My daughter had just gone to bed, and my girlfriend and I were ready to kick-back, relax, and watch a movie on Netflix.
At first, I put a half teaspoon into a cup of water and consumed, but after ten minutes I decided that I wanted to mega-dose to really see what this stuff could do. I immediately got off my couch and made another drink.
This time I consumed one and a half teaspoons, so now my total consumption after 15 minutes was two teaspoons. Within about 20 minutes I was more relaxed than I can remember being in a LOOOONG time. I felt amazing, I was so chilled out I could barely talk, and I got the best night of sleep in months.
How To Use Kava 70% Kavalactones Extract For Opiate Withdrawal
I’m serious folks, this kava extract is the REAL DEAL. If you want to ease anxiety, soothe sore muscles, relax your nervous system, enhance mood, and have a better chance at getting some sleep during opiate withdrawal, this stuff can help.
If you need more proof other than my testimonial, check out the science on it…
The following pharmacological actions have been reported for kava and/or it’s main active ingredients:
- Potentiation of GABAA receptor activity – Leads to an increase in GABA (our natural Valium) levels in the brain. Promotes mental relaxation and restful sleep.
- Agonism of CB1 receptor – Leads to very mild effects similar to those of THC, an active ingredient in marijuana.
- Inhibits reuptake of dopamine + norepinephrine – Leads to an increase in pleasure, euphoria, and concentration.
Note: To help relieve opiate withdrawal anxiety and insomnia, start off with one teaspoon Kava 70% Kavalactones Extract in a glass of water, milk or juice. If that doesn’t do the trick, take another teaspoon. Use it a few times per day as needed to ameliorate symptoms. My girlfriend and I like to mix kava with slightly chilled spring water.
*Mix it with the kratom mentioned previously for enhanced symptom relief, and it’s especially important to use after discontinuing kratom completely.
5. Passion Flower Extract 6% Flavanoid 2o:1
Passion Flower is a beautiful flowering plant that has a long history of use among Native Americans in North America and European colonists.
In a study from 2001, passion flower extract plus clonidine was shown to be MORE EFFECTIVE than clonidine alone in the management of mental opiate withdrawal symptoms. Below is a picture of passion flower.
Passion flower increases brain levels of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA). GABA is an inhibitory neurotransmitter that acts as a “mental relaxant,” and I often refer to it as the brain’s natural Valium.
Passion flower also contains monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibitors. MAOs are enzymes that break down neurotransmitters and stop their messaging activity.
Thus, consuming passion flower can lead to an abundance of the following mood-boosting chemicals in the brain:
- Serotonin – Makes you feel emotionally relaxed.
- Dopamine – Responsible for feelings of pleasure and enjoyment in life.
- Norepinephrine – Increases energy, fights fatigue, fights depression, and helps the body respond to stress.
- Epinephrine – Fights fatigue, fights depression, helps the body respond to stress, and increases energy.
The Buzz
When I tried the Passion Flower from Top Extracts, my experience was AWESOME. I’ve been taking passion flower on and off for over a decade, and this was the highest-quality product I have ever used.
I mixed a half teaspoon with some water, and within 30 minutes I was feeling more relaxed and joyful. However, the best experience was when I mixed the Passion Flower Extract with White Vein Borneo Kratom and Kava 70% Kavalactones Extract.
How To Use Passion Flower Extract For Opiate Withdrawal
If you’re going to try out Top Extracts Passion Flower, start off with one teaspoon in a glass of water, milk or juice. If this doesn’t do the trick, take another teaspoon.
Consume this passion flower beverage a few times per day as needed to ameliorate withdrawal symptoms such as anxiety, insomnia, GI upset, and depression. Below is a picture of Passion Flower Extract 6% Flavanoid 20:1.
Conclusion
TopExtracts.com has insanely awesome kratom, kava, passion flower, and other extracts and powders. The prices are very affordable, and the ease-of-ordering and awesome customer service make it a great company to buy from.
To sum things up, please review the following pros and cons of Top Extracts:
Pros
- High-Quality – The extracts and powders are truly of exceptional quality, and their products are shipped directly to them from regions all over the world such as Indonesia, South America, and Africa.
- Competitive Pricing – Some companies charge a lot for kratom, but Top Extracts has really good deals on kratom and other products.
- Customer Service – Top Extracts is quick to answer any questions and their fans come first above anything else.
- Discrete Packaging – Top Extracts products are sent in an unmarked branded USPS box, and each item is packed in a resealable black pouch.
- Priority Mail – They ship Monday-Saturday via USPS Priority Mail (Free if your purchase is over $45), so the products typically come very fast!
Cons
- Individual Biochemistry – We are all human, but natural products can have different effects on different people. Luckily, the vast majority of people have very positive benefits from the products mentioned in this review.
If you have any questions regarding this Top Extracts review, please post them in the comment box below and I will be sure to respond in a timely manner. To get 15% off your first order, use the link below:
—>Click here and use this promo code: Welcome Friends>>
Please Note: If you liked this article, you’ll LOVE my latest, Top Extracts Review Part II article, where I review all of the newest opiate withdrawal remedies from Top Extracts. Click on the link below to check it out!!!
https://opiateaddictionsupport.com/top-extracts/
Hey Matt,
Just a few questions. I’ve been one to abuse Kratom, I had terrible depression after having my son.
I slipped fell and tumbled ending up on suboxone, I’m on day 14 without anything. But Kratom at night and I’m maybe taking a total of 1 1/2 teaspoons of Kratom per night. The insomnia is what kills me during withdrawal. I can deal all day long but when I go to lay down I toss and turn.
Is this enough to get hooked on? What’s the best way to come off it? Should I work my way down as the withdrawal let’s up.
Suboxone has never been anything but trouble for me. I was on it 4 years, got clean I was on it only a couple weeks and I’m just now seeing the end of the withdrawal. Just needing some guidance. Thanks for all you do. You have helped me tremendously!
Hello, I found this article by chance as I was trying to research Kratom. I heard it helps with withdrawals, and this site just gave me so much hope. It almost seems too good to be true. I have been taking prescription percs and oxys for about five years and about two years ago I got mixed into taking “fakes” which basically are fentanyl pills. The withdrawal is horrendous. I want to stop so bad, its all I think about all day every day. I have studied this article and am ready to purchase the red and green strains of kratom. Or maybe red and white. My question: How long after my last dose of these hellish fentanyl pills should I take the first teaspoon of kratom? I am nervous because I have tried switching to suboxone and I took it too soon after my last dose and it sent me to the gates of hell. I just want to do this right so I can be done. Please help
I too got on those dirty 30s . I hate them and I think too on a daily on how to get off. can you please tell me how you are doing now. and what you used thank you so much xxoo
Matt, I’m following this guide to kick subutex finally. Im basically starting now. Although I’ve already taken your advice and purchased from Topextracts…I tried to follow ther link for 15% off on this article seems I get a 404 page not found message. Do you know the code? You can email me below.
Thanks again.
Im relying on you and your experience tpo help me through this.
This site is gonna change my life. Thank you for sharing your story.
That’s bizarre. I clicked the link and it works fine. I wonder what is going on? Maybe your browser? Or something else…
The code is: Welcome Friends
If you type that in it gives you 15% off your first purchase.
And I’m so glad my site is going to change your life!! It’s comments like yours that keep me inspired to continue publishing free articles and videos. Thanks for the feedback!! I really appreciate it. 🙂
Hello, I have been looking for the step by step detox suggested plan for methadone but cannot find it. So sorry if I am repeating what others have said…
I am starting my detox from 120mg of methadone the first week of October.
At what milligram should I begin kratom?
Do I have to be 24+ hours methadone free to begin taking kratom?
I think I read that suboxone might be a good idea to take before kratom; detox methadone>suboxone>kratom. Is this the best method?
At what mg methadone is it safe to switch to suboxone? And at what mg is it safe to switch to kratom?
How many hours should I wait in between by last methadone dose to take subs? How many hours between my last sub dose is it safe to take kratom?
Sorry for so many questions. I am so ready and want to do this the right way. Thanks in advance!
Hey!! My favorite method for getting off methadone is my Kratom-Transition-And-Taper Method. That will provide you with the step-by-step process to using kratom to get off methadone. It has everything you need to know.
Thanks for commenting, Matt. I am diligently taking notes and creating my detox schedule on a blank calendar as we speak.
Just FYI, I have tried to post on several of the other blog posts, especially the one about Methadone Weight Gain and OIE as well as How to Detox Methadone Without Withdrawals.
To my dismay, both times I tried to post nothing appeared. I even wised up and tried to copy and paste my post in another persons thread but that did not appear either.
Do you mind responding to this now? I have gained 50 pounds on Methadone. I am a petite 5’3, and should never be over 130. I am at 170. I don’t even need to explain what this has done to me, as I have read your empathy here.
I am on 120mg and have been for 4 years. Ready to come off (I check off every box in your begin to taper checklist). I want to do it as fast as possible. As fast as possible. I am ready to experience some discomfort, but obviously want to eliminate as much of that as possible.
Here is my plan: I would like to taper methadone 10 mg every week. I plan on switching to kratom at 70-80 mg and discontinue methadone completely at that point. I fortunately have the money to buy the Opiate Withdrawal Supplements and possibly even the Kyani.
From past experience and what people have told you, how bad to you think the detox will be? Do you have any recommendations on how to make it better? I know you might say taper off methadone slower, so what is the fastest recommendation you may have?
At stopping methadone at 70or 80 mg, how would one typically need to stay on the kratom?
I even have a weeks worth of sick days to take from work, so I can factor that luxury in there.
I am so ready Matt, I have spent the whole day on your page reading up, and have so much hope now! I cannot believe I suffered with this weight, constipation (even though I take detox digestion teas daily, drink water, fiber supplements, fruits, veggies, exercise strenuously 3x week), this sweating all the time I won’t let my my boyfriend touch me b/c its so embarrassing (even though I take 3 Vitadone tablets a day!). I have been afraid to come off, but not anymore!
This weight has ruined everything about myself, its all I think about every time I look in the mirror I want to cry! My love of 5 years has been by my side but I am afraid I will lose him too if I keep blowing up!! I ordered the DHEA supplement to help with weight gain in the meantime b/c I am at my wits end.
Thanks so much, I really hope this goes through.
Anna did you ever get off? You & I are very similar. I’m tapering and down to 46 mg but it’s slow and hard and I sweat so bad. It’s like the cold chills. The weight gain has been my hardest trial. I’m hoping to get off soon.
Mandy! Hi, yes I did! It has been since March 12th and I am still methadone free. I did it with Kratom, Gabapentin, Clonidine, Elimidrol AM and PM, and Doxepin (for insomnia). That is actually why I came back on the site today. To look for more sleep remedies. I am averaging 4 hours of sleep a night, in 2 hour spurts. I am out of Gabapentin, and have a little Clonidine, which is why I can sleep for 2 hours, then it seems to wear off. It settles my restless legs. I guess my body is just getting used to being on methadone for 5 years, and rebooting. The Kyani I heard is great for cell renewal, but its so expensive. I have already spent so much on supplements. I got DHEA for the weight gain a while back. DIdn’t really help me lose weight but helps with my mood for sure! But the good news is that I have lost 25 pounds. My heaviest was 175 and I am down to 150. Pretty quick weight loss. Also, I no longer eat or even care for sweets and am blown away by how much food I was eating. I guess the methadone made me numb and I never realized when I was satiated?? Anyway, good luck! You can do it! I had my take homes, and was able to taper myself off. At ~15-20mg I cold turkey’d and switched to Kratom. I didn’t sleep for 7 days straight, even with Elimidrol. On day 7, I went to a family doctor because I was having a panic attack. My heart was pounding through my chest, and my vision was going black. That is when he have me he Gabapentin. THIS IS A GAME CHANGER. 100%. He wrote me the maximum for Alabama = 3 x 300 mg a day. That script lasted me 40 days, and I even gave some away. Powerful and AMAZING stuff for withdrawals. Gets rid of the “heeby jeebys” or the skin crawls and puts your body at ease. Gotta be careful though, has a potential for abuse. Keep me posted on your progress! You can do it!!!
Hey Matt. Great site. I’m on day 2 with no subs. I took red Bali last night and it kept me up with a rapid heart rate. I only took one tsp. Today I took green mang da. I don’t have much energy though. I’m scared. Emotional. And need to be off subs. I was on methdone for 11 years and switched to subs a little over a month ago and got down to .5 and jumped. My hair started falling out when I switched. I have had every lab ran. All perfect. So I know it’s the subs. I just need to know people can do this. Thanks……tears…..😓
Hey Suzy, I am at the end of day 13 of my suboxone jump and it does get better I promise. The first week was the worst for me but lasts about 12 days or so sometimes a little more. You did it right imo going from methadone to suboxone (super short term) then jumping off. That definitely works to make it a little easier but will still take time. For me kratom made me nauseous and also caused rapid heart rate so I didn’t take it after day 2. Maybe I dosed to high but I thought I started low around 5 grams. Either way I would suggest asking your sub doc for clonidine and gabapentin and/or a benzo to help sleep and even get through the day. Most will prescribe something to help get through the withdrawals. I have done much better on work days than days I stayed at home for some reason. Keeping busy and my mind off of everything seems to help a little at least. Having the energy to work was the headrest part during week one but week two wasn’t near as bad. Still low energy but seems to be coming back. Take care and stay strong.
Thank You again Matt, just a quick update to follow yesterdays story I wrote. Ok, guys, this is the REAL deal. This WORKS. Woke up this morning, I was immediately in withdrawal, pupils large and in pain. I took a tablespoon of the kratom with 1 cup of grapefruit juice, I waited. At first I was nervous but within 15 minutes I started feeling it. It’s been about an hour since I woke up now and the first thing I noticed about this wonderful plant is I had absolutely NO spine pain. Spine pain has always been one of the worst parts about withdrawals for me. I feel slightly euphoric, no sick stomach, and a sense of peace and well being. Just Wow Matt, I just cannot give you and the suppliers of this plant enough credit. I have zero fear now, that’s saying a lot because fear IS the mind killer during the detox process, at least for me. In hindsight, the one thing I would have done differently is I would have ordered the Calm Support when I ordered the Red Horn. My hands are shaking even with the 1 mg of klonopin I took to try to stop it. I am going to place an order for the Calm support this morning, I would really like to try it because I wouldn’t hesitate attempting to get off of the benzos as well. Oh well one baby step at a time. I will be calling my Vape shop this morning also and recommending to my friend to place a quite large order of kratom from Top Extracts. Well that’s it for now, I will drop back in again as my recovery progresses. I will be using the Kratom like you suggest Matt, ONLY for 14 days. I don’t want to become a slave to anything else. This is a strong plant, it is perfect for the withdrawal process but I want to be truly clean from ALL mind altering substances in the end. Since I had weaned down to such a low dose like you recommended in your article I think 14 days will be more than adequate for me. Good Luck to EVERYONE out there struggling to find relief, All are in my prayers and best wishes. Thank You once again, you are a Wonderful human being!!! 🙂
Haily, you’re an inspiration, you get it gurl! Hope now your’re, since your post was in Feb in a great place, off all meds/etc and kratom… I know it’s very hard to get your mind to think in a different way and truly 100% commit to it. You seem to have that down. I do too thank God literally. I know w/o Him I’d not be here or have the strength to start on the road I’m very nearly off. As quickly as I can my issue is a chronic pain pt b/c of illness docs got me on strong meds, many and shorty story it’s time to change up this life & do all by natural, alt, homeopathic, eastern treatments. On last Fentanyl patch, 2 days that’s dead and off totally!!! From 200mcg/h Fent & morphine ER & reg for breakthrough pain. Lost the pills 1st, and used patches to go down. Like you I’m using Matt’s great suggestions, kratom, calm support, vit c, DL phenylalanine, working out etc. Hoping when off in 2days of all narcotics, I’ll be ok and can go down then off kratom etc. Just hope it’s smooth & getting off kratom isn’t another ‘detox’ itself? Want to send love & support to all going on this journey to freedom and really living, sick or not taking all tht crap doesn’t make u better just dependent on them & damn getting off has beeen hell even tapering, maybe did it too fast but wanted off asap & that’s just me, mind made up. Got off track want to let you know if you’re starting in middle or free it’s a journey well worth taking, there is light at the end of the tunnel and it’s so close I can taste it, can’t wait till it’s out of me fully and not ever going back. Starting acupuncture tmw! Joining a gym, walking 1hr+ aerobicly a day in 🌞 when it’s out, vit d! Best of luck to all, God bless and know this is possible I’ve been on loads of prescriptions for nearly 30yrs, some off, mostly on & Fentanyl which is cray strong every second going into you is something to get ur body off , but possible, if I can do it anyone can 3decades on narc’s of some kind?! Didn’t need it really, there. is a different road even if u have constant pain as I do. Take care, be well!!
Damn Mark- wow, YOU are inspiration.. comment is a year & half back.. how are you doing?
Matt I am 42 years old my wife is 53 we have spent the past 10 years on methadone we finally made the decision to quit the clinic it’s been 1 year and a half off that terrible drug but we still need Subutex we take from 2 to 3 milrams a day an I am so sick of still being sick every month it’s not as bad as methadone withdraws but still in the same reulim my high school friend mentioned to me that she kicked methadone with subs an subs with kratom so 3 hours later I have read your mission in life to help people like me an I can’t wait to try it I am disabled from a horrible thing thrown in jail 190 milgrams of methadone for 4 years an got put in a cell for 13 days for child support I jumped off the 2 floor because of my withdraw an did not sleep for 13 days from methadone withdraws so I looked at the 8 oz bottle of classic red I don’t know how much that is in milgrams do I need 2 _ 8 oz bottles because it’s me an my wife I need some advice what you recommend for the first week we are down to 2 to 3 milrams of Subutex a day this is all new to me so if you find time in your schedule drop me a link thanks bro an wish there were more people like you
Hey Rogan, I just came off suboxone 38 days ago (after 4 years on subs and 4 years on methadone before that) so I know where you are coming from. I jumped off at 1mg daily use and did pretty well. I must say however that I had gabapentin to help during the first few weeks (taken only at night for sleep) which was a great help. If you can get a script from your sub doc this med would be beneficial. Also check out clonidine if you have access to a doc that will help. Anyway, as for kratom everyone is different so it’s best to start at a low dose (2 or 3 grams) and move up until you find what works for you. There are about 28 grams in 1 ounce so the 8 oz bag you mentioned would give you about 224 grams. You can do the math from here to see what you will need but keep in mind that sub withdrawals last at least 12 days but can last several weeks. For example (kratom dosing), if you land your dose at 5 grams 3 times per day then 8 ounces will last one person about 15 days. You may need more or less than this dose and your wife will likely need a different dose than you (since we are all different). Also Keep in mind this is Powder form which you can either swallow with juice or water or cap them with a capsule machine if you don’t care for the taste. It doesn’t taste great but you get used to it and it’s not that bad. Also you can buy premade capsules from the same site but it’s more expensive than doing it yourself. I would suggest buying from the site that Matt mentions in his articles here since they have high quality products and there are allot of junky stuff out there on other sites. Also most locally bought stuff is junk as well but it is possible to find high quality locally it just may take some trial and error first. I hope this helps my friend. Message back if you need anything else. I am more than happy to share what has helped me get through this. I am still early in the process but I am past the acute phase of it which is the most severe. Take care.
One more thing. You may want to try red Bali and white Borneo or maybe another strand at first to see what helps you the best. Maybe buy a small amount of each at first then go back for more. The red is your best bet for withdrawals imo but the white can help with energy during the day (mixing white and red).
Hi everyone, I’m new to kratom but not to opiates. I have gone through a few really terrible withdrawals from methadone and oxycontin. Last week I ran across this article that Matt has so nicely organized and detailed. I knew that as of tomorrow I would be coming off of my last subutex, only about .5 mg as I have weaned myself off of the methadone (off 1 week now) and took my last dose of approximately .5 mg of subutex this morning. I ordered 8 oz of the Red Horn Kratom because as Matt said the Classic Red is often out of stock since it the most sought after. This morning I went to my Vape shop for some coils and my favorite juice which also happens to be the place I first even heard the word kratom. My friend the owner new I had been struggling with my addiction and he gave me about 4 grams of some strain of kratom he just happened to have and told me to try it. I did, but had no clue on dosing, so the small amounts I took really didn’t have any effect except I thought I felt just a tad bit mellow. Well this morning I stopped in and told him I would be detoxing tomorrow and had ordered the Red Horn, and he pulled out and gave me 3 packets of each strain, I think one was super green, which had 6 capsules, classic red, which had 3 capsules and the white ma daeng, which had 6 also. I was so excited to actually be able to test the strains. Well I took the 6 green first, It hit me pretty quick, My lips got numb and the pain in my spine from the methadone withdrawal left, I felt euphoric and energized. Yes, even on the subs, coming off methadone id not comfortable for the first 7-10 days. After about 30 minute I then took the 3 Red Bali, within about 10 minutes I started to mellow down, What a beautifully pleasant mixture. I was so pleased I then took the 6 white ma daeng, LoL I was literally stoned. I felt NO pain, GREAT sense of well being and just plain tipsy, I was almost worried about driving home. My tolerance for for most drugs, herbs, etc… is quite high so I waited and chatted with home for a bit and then went to the store to pick up my grapefruit juice and came home. As soon as I got home I got a text message saying my package I had ordered was in my mailbox. So today I got my Red Horn Kratom. It had been about 4 hours since my last dose of the white ma daeng and I was really excited to try the Red Horn. So about 45 minutes ago I mixed about a tablespoon of the Red Horn with a cup of the grapefruit juice and drank it down. I am VERY pleased!!!! I can tell that this strain will take the edge off and make this detox bearable. Right now I feel happy and kind of stoned feeling. I have no pain, no anxiety and I have the munchies really bad at the moment. This is just the beginning of my story and my journey back to recovery. I will share off and on about this detox experience as I go through it, which will actually begin in the morning. I’m definitely not terrified like I had been. Just testing this product and feeling the results has given me so much courage and hope. Right now I am quite tired and am headed for a nap which is rare for me. I want to add, this product got to me in 2 days, it is fresh and packaged with love like it says on the label. Thank You so VERY much to Matt who has helped make this journey possible for me. I wouldn’t have had this relief if not for this article because the original doses I had taken were too small. I think a tablespoon is going to be my happy spot. I’ll be back with another update soon. Again Thank You Matt and Thank You Top Extracts!!!!
Hi Haily,
WOW!!! I loved reading your epic post! It was so inspirational! Glad this article helped you figure out some great things that could help you feel better. And THANKS for posting your awesome testimonial here. I absolutely love plant therapy. Yahoo! Take care, Haily. 🙂
How’s life now.? Hope u made out well.
Thanks Matt for your work. I am looking at getting off suboxone; long long time prescription and appreciate your reference to good Kratom source for USA no hassles. How much Kratom should I be prepared to purchase for a good long treatment to get off Suboxone? Michael
Hi Michael,
It’s my pleasure. And to get off long-term Suboxone, you’ll probably need about 2-3 months worth of kratom. But only about 4 weeks of stabilization, then the rest tapering down weekly. If you’re going to buy it all at once you get a super good deal on the breakdown. I would get a pound of Classic Bali and a pound of White Borneo in that situation. Or, you could purchase a small amount first to see how you respond to it, then if it works well, which it should, you could invest in the bulk. But around 2 pounds seems like the magic number to get off long-term Suboxone. If you have any other questions just ask. I’m happy to assist you my friend.
I want to know which is best for wds for 100mgs if percs a day? I work full time and stay busy so I want to avoid nodding off. Please help! I’m tapering down so I can detox. And if possible can someone point me in the direction for capsules???
Red Bali is the most sedating and White Borneo is more uplifting. I recommend a combination of both for coming off Percs.
I’m very grateful to having found this site and information. I’ve been on Suboxone for 4-5 years, medically mostly, and have been on an 8 mg dose for most of it. Recently, for many reasons I’ve made up my mind to get off of Suboxone. I tried cold turkey a couple of years ago and after toughing it out for 5 days I couldn’t do it. I’ve tapered down to 4 mg lately and had planned to be tapered off by April of next year. But, I may have a change of plan now. I think i’ll get stable on 1 to 2 mg of Sub. then give Kratom treatment a shot. Tapering is going well. Slow but steady. Again, thanks to all.
God Bless,
Steve
Hi Matt its Donnie I’m on 3 day on extracts no subs first day 3 xspoon full of each of classic ,white, 70 ,Passion flower ,per day 2 day 2x 3 day plus clam support trying one then going to see what happens not filling to bad really mean to say it’s working just wanted to put that out their I’m not to sure on we’re to go from here I m worried about my dose that I’m taking don’t want this to be another addiction do I just keep trying to cut my dose down over the next few days r stay on this dose and just stop after 7 days
Hi Donnie,
I look at it like this…use kratom to transition off stronger pharmaceuticals, then taper the kratom, while taking supplements, and it should always be easier than coming off a stronger opioid cold-turkey. You might want to have some extra kratom on hand to draw out your taper over 2-3 weeks, as that can help lessen symptoms even more than 7 days.
Hi. I’m going to help a friend taper off of 50-60mg percocets and oxycodone a day. She has been on them for 2 years. She also takes 1-2mg of Xanax a day over the last year. We are going to follow the program with the Kratom, Kava and Passion Flower from topextracts.com. We read that you suggest to wean off of opiates first and then taper off of Xanax. She would like to do a slow taper off of opiates, not cold-turkey. Our question is if you can provide a suggested program such as amounts of each substance as well as best time to take and if water will be ok. We read it tastes gross but that’s ok compared to withdrawals! We didn’t think she should use grapefruit juice as we have read that it interacts with Xanax. Is there any one of these substances that are not safe to take while on Xanax? We understand that each person may respond differently but would so appreciate a sample guideline considering her dose and time on them. We truly appreciate your time! You are an amazing person and are so grateful for your help! Best Wishes to everyone that is going through this. Your stories have been very inspiring and hope you all are doing well.
Hi Toby,
Yes the Xanax interacts with many things. Kava and grapefruit juice to name just a few. As far as custom protocol designing goes, I actually do professional phone consultations for those. Click here to learn more about the process. And thank you so much for the sincere compliments and feedback. It means a lot! 🙂
Hi Matt my name is Donnie I’ve been on suboxon for about 4 years now at 20 mg at my peak I have winged my self down to 4 mg in the past 3 weeks I have bad lower back pain the last week not able to sleep I’m going to do this this time when do you think would be good dose to stop subs start taking kratom I’m on calm suport rite now what does do you think I should take I’m going to get red N white kratom and going to get kava as will and thinking about the flower thank you for all your doing we really need some one like you out their thanks
Everyone is different so this answer may vary slightly from person to person. I would suggest a red strain throughout the first couple weeks of wd. Red seems to work best initially but after a while they may get a bit sedating. After the worst of the physical wds (couple weeks for many) you can also go with a mix of green (also good for pain) or white (good for energy and slighter wds) or mix them both together. most ppl i know use anywhere between 2-4tsp every 4-5hrs throughout the wd period. I think since again most ppl are doff you have to find that sweet spot yourself. The good thing is kratom is very fast acting so this shouldnt be an issue. It takes as little as 15-20 for it to hit the system working. Another thing to be mindful of is that you should push yourself a little bit each time you start hitting the wd symtoms also. This is not going to be fun but its a way or you to start letting your brain push itself to making the endorphins/dopamine on its own. This isnt gonna be part of the routine through the first couple weeks but thereafter you may want to consider that along with the Calm Support (which is helping do the same). If thoe 2-4tsp isnt cutting it than modify until you have a handle on the symtoms just dont overdue it and monitor what is working. I wrote it down for ea serving until i knew. I was a 5yr sub user and have been clean of it since the end of august. it WORKS. I have even had days recently where i took no kratom at all and did absolutely fine. not even RLS. everyone is different. GOOD LUCK
Hi! Thank you so much for your invaluable information! My kava kava and passion flower from Top extracts just arrived today and I am trying to figure out how to prepare the powders to drink. a lot of websites are saying that it is better to put the powders in milk for the kavalactones to be extracted into the drink and then you’re supposed to strain it and that goes for the passion flower as well I’m not really sure and I’m really confused and I’m hoping you could clear this up for me so that I can mix the two powders to drink… thank you so much for your great information I’m hoping this will help me withdrawal from heroin and get my life back.. -J
Matt… I’m still patiently waiting on your reply… I am uncomfortable starting until I know I have everything right; I don’t want to waste the money I have spent and not take it correctly. The Passion Flower I have is 4% from Top Extracts, and the Kava Kava is 70%. My only question is, do they need to be strained after I mix them with water? And does the kava need to be mixed with milk? I emailed the people from TE, and they said to mix a couple of grams of kava with 6oz of cold water, and the same for the passion flower except with hot water… however, from all the research I’ve done, I’m finding that the kavalactones apparently come out better in milk and that you’re supposed to strain it because it reduces nausea and dermopathy. But, some companies offer an “instant” kava, where you just mix and drink.. but I’m not sure if the one I bought is instant because Top Extracts doesn’t say that it is. I also bought 2 1oz bags of precapsulated kratom, 1 “OG Bali” and 1 “Maenga Da Red Vein” from Phytoextracticum, because TE was out of the Classic Red whatever it was… I’m wondering if this will be enough, 2oz, for a week of withdrawal from heroin?? I have a pretty huge tolerance, and have to do at least 1g/day. Considering I’m taking all three, when would be a good time to tack each, especially in regards to one another? I knew nothing about this until I found your site, so you can see I’m kind of at a loss. Please help… I really want to get my life back. Thanks, Jess.
Hey Jessica, there are many ways to take Passion Flower, Kava and Kratom. My preference is to cap them into 00 capsules and swallow with plenty of grapefruit juice (kratom) or milk (kava) or water (Passion flower) on an empty stomach. If you can stomach making a tea out of them that is certainly an option. I have made a decent tea with the kava but kratom is nasty tasting stuff so I prefer to cap it. You will likely have to play around with the dose to see what helps you. Start low and work your way up. I started around 5 grams per dose with kratom (and go up only if needed) but everyone is different so you may want to start lower depending on your tolerance. You will likely need more than 2 oz of kratom for a week based on what you described. Most dose about 3 times a day, some less some more. If it were me I would wait as long as possible after your last dose of H to start the kratom. If possible wait more than a day. I know it will be difficult but the longer you wait the more helpful it will be. The key is to use kratom for a short period to ease H withdrawals (it certainly isn’t going to be near as strong as H) then taper off the kratom. I have been where you are so I know it isn’t an easy task to get off H but can certainly be done. I hope the best for you.
Jeff-
Thanks for your reply..
My kratom is capped already, so I’m lucky. I don’t know exactly how many I have but the vendor said each capsule contains approx. 600mg of kratom.
So with the kava and passion flower, do I need to strain or not? And does it matter if it’s in milk (the kava)?
And when it comes to waiting, that’s the whole reason why I’m trying this.. because I can’t wait. I have plenty of suboxone, which I’ve used many times to help me get off.. but this time I cant seem to wait the necessary time before taking it… the last time I took it too soon and knocked myself into precipitated w/d… which was absolute HELL.. so I’m so scared of that again! I was hoping to use the kratom as a way to kind of bridge the gap between ending the H and starting the subs to ease the rest of my w/d… I also am a full-time student and a single parent so it’s just so impossible seeming. I feel like I’m about to break down… I’m so tired. And I would be so so happy if I just didn’t wake up in the morning. I’m sick of this and I just want it to end!!!
Hey Jessica, you aren’t alone here. I understand where you are coming from and you can get through this. Precipitated withdrawals suck I know, I tooknsuboxone to early coming off methadone a few years ago and it lasted 6 hours. I thought it would never end. Anyway, the truth is you have to be sick and tired of it to get off opiates, use that for to make a victory for you. As for the straining, I just take the passionflower as is, but I cap it into 00 capsules. The kava I have caped and taken and made a tea. When making a tea I use a milk nut bag to strain it and add cinnamon clove powder chocolate and lots of sugar (added to hot/boiling water first) and use half milk half water. You can also use coconut water instead but tastes different. There are many kava tea recipes online, check out some of the kava forums. I hope this helps. Please keep us posted on your progress here. God bless.
Jessica,
What worked for me was to skip the subs altogether and just start with the kratom when the H withdrawals start. Start as high as you need to with the kratom and slowly taper off of it over a two week period and you should be out of the worst and done.
In the beginning you might need something like 10 grams of kratom maybe 3X a day, maybe more?. It’s easier to either put the powder in your mouth and slush it around with water and wash it down then wash it down with some juice and eat a couple crackers or chips to get the taste out of your mouth. If you can’t do it this way you can mix it with water in a glass and just drink it and then do the juice-chips thing.
The effect takes about a 1/2 hour to kick in and is much stronger than taking caps. It’s just much more simpler and quicker especially if you’re having withdrawal. There may be times when you might want to do the caps but if you’re hurting then the above method is best.
Hey everyone… thanks for the replies. I tried. I really did. Friday night I did my last wash and went to bed. Stayed in bed until about Sat afternoon when the w/ds kicked in hard… had 3/4 of a xanax so I did about half of it in a line, smoked a little bowl of weed, and went back to bed. That night I was up puking and tossing and turning. I think Saturday I took about 20 capsules of kratom.. I don’t think it helped at all. Sunday I was just as miserable. I took 2mg of suboxone but it just made my hands and face numb and tingly… I went and picked up. Idk what to do anymore. My tolerance is too high. I go through about a gram a day. I used to have such a promising future and now I have nothing. Had I never relapsed almost 2 years ago, I would be finished with my BSN and have my RN right now. But now I have nothing and have ruined my life. My body looks like I’m abused. And I am. I abuse myself. I’m really really fed up… I just wish my tolerance wasn’t so high and that I had a vein big enough to handle the size of a shot it would take to kill me. Cuz that’s the point I’m at… I just want it to end. Sorry I’m just rambling and I don’t really have a question or anything I just figured I would give you guys an update. The kindling effect is real… It used to be so easy for me to quit, my problem was always staying clean. I can’t even GET clean now. My withdrawals would last a few days… the last time I went completely through it, it lasted 2 weeks. I’m at the point where either I’m going to die, or this is how my life is going to be until I do.
Jessica
Jessica, please don’t give up. With your tolerance you might do better finding a methadone clinic to stabilize then slowly taper down then switch to suboxone for a very short period (few weeks) tapering daily. This is what I did several years ago and it may be beneficial for you as well. There are many ways to get off opiates but you have to find which works for you. I will be honest, I was on methadone for 4 years before coming off but that time truly helped me to get used to normal life again and get away from the seeking behavior. Pleas look into to it. I didn’t know there were methadone clinics around until a friend told me, once I looked into it I found there were 3 of them within driving distance. the good thing about this is you choose your dose, not some doctor. They will start you low but you move up daily until you are comfortable. it is tough coming from H to suboxone since suboxone is only a partial agonist but methadone is a smoother transition imo. I hope this helps. Please keep us posted, we are rooting for you.
Can I use the Kratom to come off Oxycontin (40mg.per day) if I am also tapering from Effexor XR?
Hey Cindi, if it were me I would taper off one then once stable, the other. The good news is that your oxy daily dose is pretty low so hopefully this means you haven’t been on it for long. It is definitely a good thing you decided to stop now. if you have a doc you can talk to about the oxy you should ask for Clonidine and possibly some comfort meds. Every doc is different and some will not prescribe the comfort meds but should still prescribe the Clonidine. I had to ask for it specifically with my doc. As for your question about kratom, it acts similar to opiates in the brain but isn’t as euphoric. It can be a great tool to taper off oxy as well. Once you find a dose that helps you with withdrawal symptoms start tapering at least some daily. A few days up to a week should be good coming off oxy at your dose imo. Hope this goes well for you.
Hello Matt, I’ve tried to buy from your suggested vendor seems they are out of everthing I check out. I see where Chris has given a couple of others I’ll try. Do you know of these.
Fresh-Kartom. US & kratom 5280.com?
Been on oxys off & on for 20 years more on.
I am starting to think that oxy’s make pain worse. I am so tired of pain management doctor’s heavy sales on back surgerys. Jumping through hoops…
I think kratom will help with autisium.
I see where some of us have no motavation without opiods, I have no motavation on them it is a struggle & i am extremely challanged on this typing. I am on social security like the body person and i say way to go you have begun. I just have to say let everyone know the longer you wait to get off the harder it is. But where ever you start to get better, is the best place to start. If i had the money I ‘d hire you as my coach, so I will say bless you, and my the universe reward you for all that you are doing here. Again Thank you for all this
Matt thank you sooooo much for making this information easily available i hope it is the answer im looking for. i was addicted to heroin for 12 yrs and have been on methadone now for 5 yrs and want to get off for many reason the biggest being memory problems and the fact that i cant move closer to my family because thier are no clinics near them. its like a ball and chain and ive finally made the decision to get off i cant thank you enough for posting this! my only question is does this kratom show up in a drug test? i am a nurse and couldnt risk losing my career
Jennifer,
For the most part, kratom isn’t tested for on standard drug screens. I’ve heard stories online from people who claim that Kratom caused them a false positive, but should you get a false positive, keep in mind that a second confirmation exam can be done with a gas chromatography-mass spectrometry that show that no illegal drug use took place.
Some individuals who are in the military or have jobs which regularly test for drug use should consult further experts to learn more about the risks. If you are involved in a job that requires driving, operating heavy machinery or other highly technical skills, it is important that you do not use Kratom while at work.
~Mary
OAS RECOVERY SPECIALIST
Hey Mary, that’s interesting about taking kratom while in military or using heavy machinery or driving trucks. Do you say this from a safety standpoint or is there actual drug testing used in these industries that would show kratom? I ask because I recently told a friend about kratom as a tapering off methadone tool and he was concerned about it showing up in a UA. Based on everything I have read I told him he should be good (I mentioned about the false positive but further testing should clear it up). Was I wrong in this advise. He is in one of the fields you listed with yearly and random tests. I certainly understand this from a safety standpoint but I would think kratom is far less sedating than methadone, however I haven’t taken it so am uncertain. Any more info here would be great so I can pass along. I only want to give accurate info, what he decides to do with that is up to him but I would hate to give incorrect info and it cost him his job. Thank you for you help.
Jeff,
Over time, as the use of kratom rises and the legality of it has come into question, pharmaceutical companies (some of the world’s richest folks) who are probably threatened by kratom (much like mj) have pushed for drug testing to include this herb. They are also a big push for the criminalization of it too, I’d assume. So while I’m not aware of drug testing for kratom, it’s not unlikely that there is or very soon will be.
As for “driving heavy machinery” I put that there as a warning from my own experience. I had used some red borneo before that made me fall asleep, while I was sitting at my kitchen table mixing a cake! (Lol, that’s me! ?”little miss Suzy Homemaker!” ?) I dropped the measuring cup in the floor, which woke me right back up. It had snuck right upon me! So yes, some can be very sedating!
~Mary
OAS RECOVERY SPECIALIST
Thanks Mary. So was red Borneo your preferred strain after coming off suboxone. I have always heard the red strains are best for this but there are still several of those to choose from. Thank you.
Jeff,
Reds do seem to help opiate withdrawal the most. I used a red Maeng Da for daytime and red borneo for night. I know many will include green, as an aid to help with anxiety, but luckily I didn’t need that. I did however, try to beat the timeclock and try to rebound a bit too quickly by throwing some white in the mix for energy that is often lacking during withdrawal. I think worrying about having energy should wait a few days, until the adequate dose of kratom to fight the withdrawal has been found and is managing the symptoms.
~Mary
OAS Recovery Specialist
Hi Jeff,
I’ve been tested twice in the past six months with no problems at all. It was the type of test where it’s a swab connected to a stick and the swab goes under your tongue until some part of the thing turns slightly blue and then you stick it in a tube and off it goes to the lab. I’ve been offered this or a urine test. I’m not positive but my guess is that they may have the same efficiency.
I also know of a handful of places to get good kratom at great prices and all about the same great quality. Average prices are about sixty bucks for half a kilo and a hundred for a full kilo. Smaller amounts at one place are twenty bucks for a hundred and twenty five grams and thirty bucks for two hundred and fifty grams. If anyone is interested reply to me and I’ll get you a list.
Peace–Chris
Hey Chris, what were your tests for? If it was for your work, are you in a heavy machinery or commercial driving field? I ask because i was looking for the most recent info on how testing is done for them specifically. I appreciate the response either way. Also, if you have a high quality vender you want to share I will certainly look into it. Thanks.
Hi Matt – It was a true pleasure to find and read your site, after trying to get off Oxycodone and Methadone a little to quickly. I’m a retired 64 year old building superintedent that didn’t do the research, which I usually do, and had a major back sugery, then another to fix what the surgeon had done wrong, and the third to take out all the insturmentation, all within 6 years. The Oxy and Methadone were given together for severe back pain after the 3 surgeries 12 years ago and it’s time to get off them. I know now you have to give the body something to replace what the body is yearning for. I know this will work because I got off clonozopam, which is supposed to be verry hard, by just weaning off slowly, but the help really came from the oxy and methadone as I now think about it. I’m a lacto=vegan, and am very healthy due to a past history of body building and know quite a bit about diet. I was pretty excited to find your site as after finding out the hard way that the body is very dependent on Methadone. Oxy, personally doesn’t feel like it’s going to be as nuch of a problem, but that could be wrong. Today bought Red Maeng Da (4oz) and White Borneo 4(oz) because the Red Bali was out. Also got Passion Flower (4oz) for anxiety. Weaned down to 10mg of methadone and 15mg of oxycodone, but even though I consider myself pretty resilient, that’s a tough place to be. You don’t want to stop your life and get sick for a week to do this, and that’s was I’m pretyy excited about this Kraton. I also have a bottle of year old Gabapentin, which took away the restless body ( if you don’t go out and walk fast with this for a few miles, you can’t sit and mentally contain it). Wanted to use the Gabapentin also., but if the Kraton does it’s job , another chemical doesn’t have to go in the body. Take a lot of supplements so I don’t think I need the herbal supplement (can’t remember the name), but would like your opinion on that. Am back up to 10 mg Methadone and 15 mg oxycodone twice a day to stay sane. Will try this whole thing after a few emails. You’ve done a good thing here with all your research and time on this site. Thanks.
I went to the site to order some classic red kratom, and it says not for human consumption. Am I in the wrong spot? I’m confused.
Heather,
No, you’re finding correct information. Kratom has not been approved for use as a dietary supplement by the FDA. Therefore it cannot be sold as anything for human consumption. There is something written called “The Kratom Bible” that you can Google and find much information.
~Mary
OAS Recovery Specialist
Heather, they have to put that on their site for legal reasons. You are at the right spot. Any more questions feel free to ask.
Hi Heather,
Most kratom vendors say that just to cover themselves legally. You can buy good kratom on these sites for prices that’s less than many others. I have experience with both and was happy each time. I like reds for relaxation and maeng da and whites for energy and motivation. If you have questions you can find a lot of info on reddit and you can ask questions as well. And less is more or better is really true. You’ll have to experiment to find a dosage that’s right for you. Start at 2g and work up from there until you find it. https://www.reddit.com/r/kratom/search?q=kratom
Peace, Moderation and Best Regards–Chris
Here are two vendors I’m familiar with.
https://fresh-kratom.us/
http://www.kratom5280.com/
Hey Matt! I love all your info. I have been on the suboxone program for 9yrs now and I am so ready to be off of them. I have been switched around to several different docs, some that wanted to wean me asap and also had told me I may be on it for the rest of my life! Suboxone was a miracle in my life, I have come so far, have not relapsed in 8yrs. I occasionally have cravings.. The only problem is wth this new doc he has been weaning me and it DOES NOT WORK FOR MY BODY CHEMISTRY. I cannot mention it to him, because he’ll think I am seeking more. I am tired of feeling controled by all this. And the money I have to pay for my script is outrageous! I could of bought a new home by now wth the money I have forked out. I think everybodys BODY CHEMISTRY is different. A couple of my friends that were hardcore into the opiates, but had to be off completely and huge turn around for them. I want to do this, I am very weak minded and love to feel good.. Like the opiate happy feeling 🙂 should I be off my suboxone a day before I try the kratom? Like don’t take a sub in morning before I try the tea? I only have red horned, Borneo red flyer, and the new indo redhead, the owner that new alot about kratom was not at the store to let me know what works best. I just played it by here and guessed. Thank you for sharing your story 🙂
Hi Tammy,
If it were me, I would start taking kratom as soon as I first felt the fist sign of withdrawal. That might be a day or shorter or longer, but that’s how I would approach it if it were me. Make sure to ask your doctor what you should regarding this, however. And best of luck to you…and thanks for sharing, and I hope the absolute best for you! Feel free to post any updates as well. 🙂
Matt:
I ordered your Ultimate Withdrawal Course along with the “50 ways” but honestly haven’t started yet. I have yet to see posts from anyone on the meds I’m taking (for at least 5-6 yrs now) which are 8mg hydromorphone every 4 hrs (except middle of the night – doc cut that) and 0.6ml opium tincture every 4 hours for bone tumor pain and chronic diarrhea, respectively. Both of these problems are caused by a rare thyroid cancer. I’m also on, 0.5mg xanax 2x/day for anxiety. Half the time, these opiods are stimulating, and half the time they put me to sleep, which is horrible along with the chronic fatigue that comes from the cancer itself. When I get up in the morning (or afternoon or evening – as these meds really wreak havoc with my sleep/wake cycle), I have so much anxiety I take the xanax, but if I then sit down, It’ll put me right back to sleep, sometimes several hours. The anxiety isn’t just from the opiates though… it’s also the cancer issue along with a 6 year ongoing high-conflict divorce with a narcissist who just won’t settle – continuously delays proceedings, etc. So I guess the reason I haven’t yet started the program is that I have all of those fears you mentioned…. What will I do about the chronic problems caused by the cancer when I no longer have the opiods that work to relieve those problems; what will I do about the acute anxiety as I know the cancer won’t suddenly disappear (I’ve had it nearly 20 yrs and it keeps slowly growing – mostly in bones now – but has never been in remission) and the divorce has no end in sight.
Do you recommend trying to taper off or just quit cold turkey, all three of these meds at once or one at a time, and if one at a time, which one first? Also, out of the 50 ways, which 3 would you recommend to try for getting off the meds that I’m taking?
FYI, I also am trying CBD Oil (from hemp, so legal here in NC). I think it has helped a little, but for my issues I need a lot more and it is sooooooo expensive, I can’t afford as much as I need to see a real benefit. For that matter, even though the products on topextracts.com are said to be reasonably priced, everything is expensive when you’re on cancer disability; living on SSDI which doesn’t even cover the rent.
Almost forgot…. I was given a steroid (1st time ever) to reduce inflammation in my back when awaiting an MRI of lower lumbar. I was having the MRI because I was recently (in Feb) diagnosed with peripheral arterial disease and have 3 blockages in left leg – main artery totally blocked, causing pain when walking. After the steroid I developed a severe case of edema in my legs and feet and am also now on 20mg lasix daily & potassium. After an arteriogram to ID the location of the arterial blockages, my left foot went completely numb (and still is) and was too painful to even sleep – in addition to the insomnia caused by the steroid – as it was worse when I attempt to lay flat or elevate feet to reduce swelling. Neither the vascular surgeon nor neurosurgeon nor neurologist has been able to identify the cause of my numb foot…. and the hydromorphone I’m on does nothing for that foot pain… but if and when they find out the cause, I’ll surely say “no” to any more Rx meds.
I know it’s a no-brainier (and I don’t need any flaming replies from other posters as I’m well aware of the negatives) but at the same time i try to quit these opiods, I also have to quit smoking cigarettes (near 40 year habit) and according to the vascular surgeon must also walk at least 30 minutes per day despite blocked leg arteries and numb foot. The cardiac doctor (who tested my heart function in expectation of possible leg bypass surgery – thankfully heart is strong and no problem) said that Chantix and other quit smoking meds are not an option for me since I’m “prone to” depression and anxiety. “Prone to” were his words though I told him I’m “already severly there.”
None of my many doctors will discuss any ‘natural’ therapies with me, and being on SSDI as I said earlier, I cannot afford to see any naturopath as most of them do not accept medicare supplement insurance and my healthcare company does not even cover ‘natural’ therapies so I cannot submit claims of my own accord. Since I cannot afford a doctor who will discuss these therapies and supplements designed to help get off of the Rx meds, I have to be my own advocate and read as much as possible… However, as you know, there is so much confusing information out there…. and why I’m so glad I found your site. Even with your site, however, there’s so much to take in…. I just need some guidance to choose the best start method(s) and help getting motivated.
So, I know you’re not a doctor, but I’d welcome “What I would do if I were in your situation.” as I’ve no other affordable avenue of information.
Thanks!
I scrolled down to the bottom of the page to the “post” box so I don’t know how my post ended up in the middle of all the postings. I’m not sure my post even belongs in this posting, but may be more suited to a general post on your website.
Hey A Stressed Body, I’m sorry to hear about all you are going through at the moment. Honestly you may be better off having an actual council session with Matt, his contact info for this is on this site. I didn’t see where you mentioned why you were wanting to stop taking you meds and if you are still in severe pain you may want to continue taking them or talk to your doc about other treatments (if they will listen). With that said if you are just determined to stop them I understand. If it were me I would quit the opiods first and the benzo a month or more later. As for which opiod to stop first that is really up to you. You have a short acting opiod (hydro morphone) and a long acting (opium) so the withdrawal symptoms for each are different. The short acting are a bit stronger generally but over much quicker. If it were me I would stop the opium first for at least 2 weeks (more if needed) before stopping the hydromorphone. The acute withdrawal from the opium will likely last about 12 days but the hydromorphone sould only last 2 or 3 days. Once this is complete I would wait until I was fully stable before attempting to stop the benzo. Tapering is your friend here, the more you are able to taper the easier withdrawal will be. I am not a doctor and this only what I would do if in your situation so take it for what it is. I hope this helps and hope your situation improves.
Hi Matt,
I’m a little confused about Top Extracts at the moment. When I initially clicked their link from your article the site came up with this URL: https://topextracts.com/ (this is the better designed site)
A few hours later I clicked the same link and got this URL: http://teas-and-extracts.myshopify.com/
Do you know what it’s about? The logo seems to be the same.
Thanks,
Chris
Must be because they are uploading a new website right now. Tonight or tomorrow it will look completely different. I got a sneak peak of the website redesign and it looks very good. You’ll see soon enough.
Hi Matt,
Thanks. I’m wondering if you know anything about getting off Gabapentin? My doctor and many others seem to think there are little to no withdrawals or problems but I have found different. Times when I have run out early or been unable to get my next script on time I’ve experienced anxiety that is crushing and my body becomes very weak but the fear is the worst, it’s absolute and has a sinister feel to it sometimes. To put it mildly, it’s no picnic. Forums all over online will attest to this. It can be dangerous to quit cold turkey.
I have many years of using kratom on and off successfully and during times of Gabapentin withdrawal it has mostly eliminated the withdrawals and put me in a place where I was functional, relatively happy, motivated and enthusiastic about life. It also brought my physical strength back.
Maybe I could benefit from using your methadone protocol by tapering of the Gaba and following your steps? I’m scheduled to see an ayurvedic practitioner tomorrow whom I know and trust that’s be doing it for almost 30 years. Some of the herbs he’ll prescribe may be the same as in your methadone protocol like the reishi mushrooms. Do you have any thoughts or opinions about any of this?
Thanks for your quick reply about the Top Extracts site. Their prices are very reasonable.
Peace–Chris
Hi Chris,
That’s awesome you went to see an Ayurvedic practitioner. I live 35 minutes away form the Chopra Center, where Deepak Chopra has Ayurvedic doctors that work there. I’ve been wanting to schedule a consultation with one for awhile now, and will likely do so pretty soon. And to answer your question, here is an article I wrote on gabapentin:
How To Use Gabapentin For Opiate Withdrawal
Hello Matt, I have a question about the extracts. You had said in a Above review to continue to take kava kava after the acute withdrawal stage. My question is for how long after would u take the kava kava when done with withdrawal. And also would like to now about Passion flower. I have read somewhere in a different forum the Passion flower is addictive. So if true one would not want to continue the Passion flower after acute withdrawal stage. Please
Clarify which extracts above r addictive and which ones r not addictive, and which ones to continue to take after acute withdrawal and for how long after to take it for? Thanks
On most supplement packages they state to only use kava or passion flower for a maximum of 30 days in a row, then to take 1-2 weeks before using it for a maximum of 30 more days. This is called “cycling.” If it was me going through withdrawal, I would use these for 30 days then stop, then wait a week, then if I still felt like I needed them I would use them as needed and not daily. However, everyone is different. Disclaimer: This comment is for informational use only, and is not medical advice. Ask your health care provider about what supplements you can take.
Hi mark
I am 1 week into methadone withdrawal however I have been using heroin to not get sick..dumb I know I just cannot handle the restless legs anxiety and major insomnia. I desperately want and need to be off opiates for myself and my daughter. I have been doing quite a bit of research on Keaton and I really want to try it.. What would you recommend I get to help ease these horrible symptoms? About how many days does it usually take thru the mail? PLEASE HELP. I do not have a job at the moment and have plenty of help with my daughter 24/7 so Idealy I would like to be energized for the day but be able to realllly wind down maybe nod a little before bed? I would love to hear from you!! Thank you
Also can you comment on the approximate weight of one teaspoon Kratom extract from TopExtracts? I’m guessing 1 to 2 grams??
When I weighed it before I think it was about 2.5 grams.
Matt,
I’ve been reading up on Kratom. Several articles said to avoid extracts completely, in that they will cause your tolerance to skyrocket quickly and unnecessarily leading to potentially nasty withdrawal symptoms. I also read that mixing different strains in the same day can actually negate each other!? I’d like to know your view on these matters.
Thanks
I prefer the kratom powders, where it takes many grams to feel the effects. These are not extracts. I’ve used liquid extracts and other extracts that only needed a little, and I didn’t like the effects as it was way too strong for me. Also, the only way I like to use kratom is by mixing them, as it most assuredly does NOT negate the effects for me, as well as anyone I’ve ever talked to that has done this. It’s like saying that taking a hydrocodone and an oxycodone together would cancel each other out….doesn’t happen.
Everyone is different, but I prefer the kratom powders in the 3-10 gram dose range, in a mixture of red vein and white vein. However, other people will have their own preferences. Disclaimer: This is for informational use only, and is not medical advice. Always ask your doctor before trying an new natural drugs.
Thanks Matt…its MY BAD…my inexperience just assumed the powders were extracts especially with the name TOPEXTRACTS. Thanks for clearing that up as well as the weight per teaspoon and ‘mixing strains’ issues.
I have tried Kratom 3x now at varying doses and mixtures. I feel it is a good recommendation and has helped my chronic pain more than I had imagined. I also find that it is really best at a low or moderate dose. I find a teaspoon or 2 of the powder is really all I need to get most of the benefit. With higher doses ( anything greater than 3 or 4 tsp), any additional benefits were offset, IMO, by the sheer nausea of the damn substance in your belly. I realize of course, as a Kratom newbie, my tolerance is low, and that may change. I also found ‘reburn’ to be a waste for the most part. I’d only recommend it if opiate withdrawal symptoms are persistent and return during the day. Seems the best bet is to take what you find works for you just once, on your initial dosing. Obviously everyone is different, these are just my experiences.
I also find ‘TopExtracts’ products to be high quality, reasonably priced, well packaged, and delivered promptly!..Can’t ask for more! Thank you for your recommendations and knowledge in these matters. It really has been helpful and I don’t experience those damn ‘opiate cravings’ with Kratom that ultimately have the potential to lead people down a dangerous path. Like everything in life, moderation is key. If you have a knowledgeable, healthy respect for Kratom, it can be a very useful tool in opiate withdrawal and/or chronic pain management.
Thanks again
Oh ya the name extracts would totally make it seem that everything on the site is that. Some of the products are extracts, some powders, and some tea, and I’m sampling new products right now to see if they are awesome. If so, Jim said he will start carrying those too. And I have a friend on 1 mg a day of Klonopin that tried the kava and it did nothing for them. But I tell ya, for a person like me that probably has a genetic GABA deficiency, this stuff is the cure.
I thank you for sharing your experience using the kratom Fred. I also find that 3 teaspoons is my absolute maximum, and I typically enjoy a dose of about 7-8 grams. I really like the “mental stimulation” and “euphoria” this size dose provides me. And I too love TopExtracts. I have tried numerous brands, both online and in herb shops and smoke shops, and Jim’s company has a great product, great prices, and it comes fast.
Again, thanks for your comments and testimonials, and I hope to hear from you again Fred.
Hi…. I am unable to log into the Tio Extracts site
I fill out the box that pops up but can’t get in… Any advice?
The box at the top is asking for your birthdate to verify yo are old enough to purchase. They really should clarify that to avoid confusion. Hope this helps.
They just launched their new website. It doesn’t have this feature anymore. Now you can type in domain name and it takes you straight to website.
Thanks Matt. I don’t remember where it was but I mentioned a while back about kava not working for me after trying two times but that I would give it a few more tries before giving up on it. So a week ago I took 5 grams and still nothing at all happened. Couldn’t wven tell I took anything. Then yesturday I took the remaining 3 grams I had and expected nothing once again but was surprised to be very relaxed, similar to taking one soma. It was a small dose so not sure what to expect with a larger one, going forward I ordered some more from top extracts so we will see how it goes. I have read about a reverse tolerance on many different websites so maybe that is what it was. I know everyone is deferent and some seem to see affects the first time taking it. Either way I will report back with my findings once I try again. Hopefully it will be a great product for withdrawal.
Hi Matt, I heard about Kratom through a neuropathy website on Facebook. I have been taking Tramadol for 5 years. My doctor prescribes 6 daily. I wanted to know if its wise to use Kratom while tapering down from 6 to 5? I just ordered 50 Red Vein Indo and tried it today for the first time.I don’t want to trade one addiction for another.
Many people have used kratom to help taper off opioids. Check out this article:
How To Get Off Tramadol Without Withdrawal
The Kava extract did nothing for me even at high dose…was like a placebo. I was very disappointed, especially based on your description. The Kratom , however definitely helps. Haven’t tried the passion flower, but I’m considering it next.
Hey Fred, I tried the kava as well and got nothing from it, even after trying it twice. I have been researching it since then and read that kava has a reverse tolerance and generally doesn’t work until you have taken it multiple times, possibly 5 or more times then you will start seeing effects from it. I don’t know how true it is but I will give it another couple tries before writing it off completely. Just passing this info along. Have a good one.
Thanks for your input Jeff. I don’t know what you read, but personally, I’ve tried kava paste with high kavalactones, and vaped kava oil, and used the powder and none of these needed 5 times to work on me. I feel the effects of kava immediately. Also, many others have emailed me personally to tell me the first time they used it the kava worked very well.
I find that people with a GABA deficiency respond best to it. If you already have good GABA levels in the brain, you may not feel anything or you may feel just a little. The first time I took two hits of kava on a vaporizer it was actually very powerful. Not a placebo at all! But people always respond differently to different things.
I thank you for your input and I hope you’ll check-in with an update after you’ve tried it a few more times. Take care. 🙂
Thanks Matt,
That would explain, perhaps, my experience with the Kava as I am on a low dose of Xanax XR ( extended release formulation) for chronic anxiety/anxiousness. Obviously this would target my GABA deficiency in and of itself, and explain why the KAVA didn’t really work for me.
Yes results can always vary with natural supplements and even medications. I respond very well to anything that increases GABA, such as kava and passion flower. However, whenever I have tried taking supplements that primarily increase serotonin, such as 5-HTP or L-Tryptophan, I do not notice effects right away and they need to build in my system for awhile. Everyone is biochemically unique, and that is why some will take antidepressant medications such as Prozac and get happy, and others will take them and become suicidal.
Thanks for sharing your experience using these plants Fred. I’m glad the kratom really helped though!
Hey Matt, thanks for all the great info here. I am planning ahead to come off suboxone. My question is about using kratom during the taper. Should I use kratom at the end of the taper when skipping days (skipping dose for the day) or should I wait until after my last dose is taken and I am in w/d? I understand you are not a doctor, I am only looking for your opinion since you are familiar with kratom and suboxone. I have never heard of kratom until now. I ordered a couple samples and some empty capsules to put it in. Also, in your opinion, which strain would work well for work after the detox period? I will have 4 days off work then back to it, one of the hardest things is I have zero motivation/energy and anxiety when not on an opiate. So looking for energy but don’t want to be over anxious either. I was thinking to mix either the red with green or the red with white, which do you prefer? Thank you. Thank you.
Hey Jeff,
Yes I can’t tell you what to do, but I can tell you what I would likely do in that same position. I would wait until coming off Suboxone completely, then as soon as I felt first signs of withdrawal, I would take kratom capsules, 50% red and 50% white. That would give me sedation, withdrawal relief, and energy. Then I would taper off the kratom over a few weeks while exercising, eating healthy, and taking nutritional supplements, which would make it easier to come off kratom.
Thank you for the response Matt. I have read many of your articles here in preparation to taper and stop suboxone. Based on a recommendation by you in one of your articles i am now reading the book end your addiction now which is very interesting. I have a list of supplements to purchase along with an even longer list of detox supplements and will be purchasing all of these. I appreciate your information here and have also purchased some kratom as I mentioned before but after reading dr Gants book (at least part of it so far) I will try my hardest not to use kratom except during acute w/d if it becomes unbearable. My question for you now is about tapering off and taking days off work. I will have 4 days off and want to use them wisely. Would you take the first 4 days of no suboxone off or work the first couple days (after final dose) then take time off work? I ask because many indicate withdrawal symptoms are at their worst after a few days but I also know I will be basically useless at work once off subs (temporarily). Currently at .38mg subs once daily (8mg strip/21) and plan to taper to .25mg before dropping off. Thank you.
Hey Jeff! You sound like a man with a plan my friend. Good for you! And congrats on getting that amazing book and supplements. Also, congrats on tapering to such a low dose of subs. As for your question:
If it were me detoxing and I could only get 4 days off work, I would tough out the first 2 days at work with no Suboxone, then on day 3 off medication I would want to start the 4 days off. That’s what I would do, but I’m not a doctor and this is just an informational comment so make sure to speak with your doctor first about what you should do. In my past experience, days 1-2 off subs were bearable, but the morning of day 3 is when thing GOT REAL! know what I mean?
Matt, I was curious to know what you mean when you say that a strain was “too stimulating”. Thanks
Hey Kyle,
What I mean is that it makes me mentally stimulated to the point where I can get anxiety and irritated, and insomnia as well.
Hi Matt,
I have been addicted to pain medications since I was 16, I’m now 30. I got into a horrible car accident on my 16th birthday and broke my ankle and tailbone. So I was put on Percocet and I have been taking any pain meds I could get my hands on ever since. About 3 years ago I started on suboxone while I was working in Vermont. When I got back to Florida I couldn’t find a Doctor to prescribe me suboxone. That’s when I hit the streets again. Well I decided I was going to quit once and for all. So I looked into methadone clinics, and low and behold there was one right down the street. I went and started taking methadone (that was about a year and a half ago) and got up to 320mg. I slept all the time on the methadone so I asked my counselor about switching to subutex and that’s what I did. I got up to 20mg. I tapered down to 4mg and yesterday was my last dose. I have withdrawn before and the worst part for me is the RLS, anxiety, and sleeplessness. My counselor printed out your page on “Suboxone remedies that work” and she helped me make a list of what to get. I found a head shop that sold kratom but it was very pricey. I ended up getting 15 grams of Malay extract and took 4 capsules (they are .5 grams each) but I’m not feeling much better. I do have a very high tolerance so maybe I need to take more. I’m just unsure how much is to much? I was wondering what strain you would recommend for my withdraws? I have nothing important for the next 2 weeks, so I’m pretty much just going to be staying home and hitting the gym when I feel up to it. Thank you so much for all the information and time you have put into helping others. Hope to hear back from you soon.
Summer I’m sorry I didn’t respond sooner as I was moving to another city this last week. Anyways, 4 capsules is only 2 grams, which is a very low dose. Someone in your situation may possibly find more relief from taking 6-10 grams at a time. The red strains are typically used the most for coming off opioids because they are the most sedating/painkilling. I’m not a doctor and cannot give medical advice, however, so please ask your healthcare provider what you should do.
Matt – I’m completely confused. I had back surgery and completely refused to take Morphone or Vicodin (due to seeing a friend get addicted). I was placed on tramadol.50mg. (Max 6 a day though I normally only took 4mg) I finally feel that I can manage the pain with hot yoga etc and wanted to get off the meds. I took my last pills as I found your website…I had no idea I should have tapered, (I’ve been on tram for 6 months) and I feel fatigue and lathargic so I called my doctor for a refill as I thought I’d taper off as your site suggested, my doctor ALWAYS requires an appmt for prescriptions and this time was no exception. I explained that I couldn’t come in as I’ve relocated 3 hrs away…so I was given a referral to a new doctor, however, the appmt is 3 weeks out….(I would think I wouldn’t need it by that time). A friend suggested using Kratom to taper off, however, Im concerned using it as I’m currently on Cymbalta 40mg…is there an issue in using both my Cymbalta and kratom? If not what strain would work best?
Hi Mel,
I’m not positive about kratom interactions with Cymbalta, but you could always Google it to find out. As for strains of kratom for tapering, every person is biochemically unique so different strains and dosages work better for different people. Sorry to hear about the situation you’re in Mel. But I know you can get through this and become stronger because of it. If you have any more questions I’m here to help along the way. Take care.
Hi. I am so glad I found this website. I wish I had this information years ago.I am trying to get off of suboxone. I have never been able to taper down past 4 mg. honestly suboxone has just replaced my old addiction. I have been on it for over 2 years. I have a toddler to care for so I have used that as an excuse to not get off of it. Of course I fear withdrawals. I am so tired of being dependent on this stuff.
My doctor told me about something called vivitrol ( naltrexone). I need to be opiate free for 7 days or until everything is out of my system. I have no idea how I can do that on my own. I figured I would taper the best I can. I do have a few tramadol and I plan on getting calm support. So my questions are…
If you are familiar with vivitrol and if I use Kratom to get off of suboxone will this effect my ability to take naltrexone? Apparently I will go into withdrawal if anything is in my system. I am assuming that since Kratom sits on the same receptors then I can’t use it.
can I mix all theses supplements? I am tempted to get every herb you listed lol.
I know I will experience some form of withdrawal and I might be prolonging the inevitable. I do exercise and eat healthy but once the withdrawal and paws kick in I am a lazy bum. I feel like vivitrol is my best option at this point if I can just make it past the withdrawals. It is very hard mentally.
Thank you.
I am not positive since kratom is not an opiate, and neither is tramadol, though both of these do in fact bind to opioid receptors, so my guess would be that it’s not wise to take them within 7 days of Vivitrol. Perhaps you would benefit more from reading about the Vitamin C protocol. Please refer to the article below:
How To Mega-Dose Vitamin C To Stop Opiate Withdrawal
Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. This comment is for informational use only. It’s not intended to treat, diagnose, or prevent any disease. Always check with your doctor before changing your diet, trying any new supplements, medications, exercise or opiate tapering programs.
***MATT–
I Cannot access topextracts website!!!
It has you date & submit legal disclaimer form then screen wiggles & it does Not let you into site. I have no security settings that would lock me out on my own system. Any chance you can post their order-line phone # Please? ! ?
Thanks for All your well written articles & your passion to help others heal. It’s been inspiring to me♡!
The date they want you to put in is your birth date, that way they know you are over 18 years old. If that doesn’t work for you, here is the phone number which I just copied and pasted from their website: Phone: (331) 481-9803
Hello HL, If you’re still struggling with a decision, may I recommend that you read WebMD and Wikipedia for the details on naltrexone. After becoming well-informed, I suspect that you will abandon this option as inappropriate for your specific issues. If you do opt out, look through Matt’s excellent information to fill in the details of this outline: (1) Write out a goal and plan (2) Start the supplements (3) Taper the Suboxone as far as you can and as slowly as you need. Just below 2mg per day, your endogenous opioids, which have been negated by the Suboxone, will have a chance to help you out. Rarely these are so suppressed that you might not be able to go below the 2 mg per day without great distress, but if you get past that level , try for 1/4 gram or less. (4) Wherever you hit the taper plateau, start Kratom at the lowest dose possible to alleviate the physical withdrawal symptoms, and stop taking any Suboxone. Kratom almost has to work because it contains opioid agonists that will give your proliferated receptors something to hang onto after screaming about being abandoned. (5) If you wish to become opiate free, try to keep the Kratom below the level where you start to feel extra-good instead of just feeling not bad or normal. Kratom can be addictive, and I’m guessing that you don’t want to trade one dependency for another. On the other hand, some folks use Kratom as a lifestyle supplement for its positive effects (energy boost, analgesia, anxiety relief, mental focus) and moderate their usage to avoid becoming hooked. Read up on Kratom and decide for yourself. (6) Taper the Kratom as low as you can and as slowly as you need. Continue to deal with PAWS as advised on this site, and consider using the Kratom for periods of break-through distress.
I took Suboxone for 5 years as a pain-management Rx, but now I’m Suboxone-free since June 1. I speak from both experience and in-depth research.
Good luck.
Charlie
I have been on sub for almost 5yrs and desperately trying to get away. I have decided to go the Kratom route and ordered 8oz if the classic red but have been seeing so much contradictory info and am confused. I also got the calm supplements. Can you advise on the best schedule because I need to do this, and want to do this but also am running a business and have two full time kids and can’t afford to give away what im doing and I’m terrified. It may be impossible to ask this but I have no options
With all due respect to kratom addiction and the suffering it can cause, I have been self medicating with it for 5 years daily to treat PTSD. I know this diagnosis is thrown around lightly nowadays but let me tell you straight, it is a living hell and nightmare, literally. I tried Rxed psych meds and I will tell you what, I’ll take kratom addiction any day of this life time over the crap psych meds. Kratom is a blessing from on high as far as I’m concerned and I would not hesitate to recommend it to anyone over the crap that our f…ed up medical system pushes on desperate folks with little hope left.
Hi, H. L. ,
I’m posting this realizing its been several months since your post and hoping you managed to wean off the subs by now. If not, I just wanted to share my thoughts. I was on Suboxone for almost a year. My doctor started me at 32 mg ! After doing some research, I realized that that was an insanely high dose. I immediately cut it to 4mg daily then began a long slow wean. Personally, I wouldn’t mess with Vivitrol. Its just an opioid receptor blocker, so nothing would work while taking it. It isn’t an agonist or inhibitor but simply a blocker. I would think this would make withdrawal symptoms worse, but I have heard of people with alcohol problems using it successfully. My main point here is that with suboxone, its essential to skip days towards the end of your taper to be free of it. This is due to its enormous half life. Any change in dose won’t be noticeable for at least 5 days. When I got my dose down to 1mg, I started skipping days..every other day at first, then every 2 days, etc. This is, IMO, the only way to get off subs completely. Just skip at your own pace, increasing at your own level of tolerance/comfort. It does work this way, but requires patience and fortitude. I was unable to cut my subs any smaller than 1mg and was unable to get sub film strips…so i stopped at 1mg rather than prolong the agony of fractional sublingual strips. But everyone is different. The most important thing is skipping days at the end. Its very important with these long half-life type opioids. I wish you all the best!
Does the Kava extract have any withdrawals? I’m on day 27 of methadone withdrawal and if I don’t figure something out I’m going to LOSE it lol.
If I were going through methadone withdrawal I would be sipping on some kava beverage. Based on my research, I haven’t found any reports of kava leading to a physical dependence. However, large doses of it for a long time can lead to many health problems. Here is the most informative article I’ve found on it for your convenience:
Kava Kava – Herbal Safety
J. Smith
Hi Matt,
I left a comment the other day and not sure if the message went through. I see just my name in this section. Did you receive a comment from me?
Hi Jill, yes the comment you left just came up as J. Smith. Nothing more. I thought it was odd but posted the comment anyways. Please feel free to post again and hopefully the full comment will post as this one did for you. Thanks.
Hmm sorry about that.
Well it’s day 9 being Vicodin free. My bf and I at our highest was using up to 150 mg -200mg a day. It all started about 3-4 yrs ago after his health issue. The withdrawal wasn’t easy but I was fortunate to have ordered the calm support (which helped me with sleep tremendously) and used kratom which is probably the reason we have gone this far.
Truthfully I haven’t felt this good in years. My bf is having a tougher time since he was the one w the medical issues but he’s healthy now and it’s mostly mental. ( he almost bought some from a dealer yesterday but he couldn’t drop it off. We call that divine intervention lol )
After reading your article on kava I m super intrigued. I ordered some kava from a portland vendor online. (The one you suggested sold out).
I ordered elimidriol daytime formula too but it was a bit strong to me for the daytime as is the calm support. It made me a groggy but I have been sensitive to vitamins bf so could be just me.
But the kratom has been a lifesaver. I know you get asked this a lot but with a a 10-15 g daily use for the last 9 days will we feel wd symptoms? Now we only take it an night at about 8-10g. How can we avoid wd from kratom at this point?
Since its natural and and helps ease stress and uplift mood it has helped out cravings tremendously. We both exercise and try to eat healthy and protein rich diet as you advised.
But sometimes we just want a break from reality. Where as most people
have a drink to relax we used opiates. And it got out of hand as it
usually does.
We understand the power behind kratom and why people get addicted but to use it as an end of work week way to unwind and relax, would that be ok during our paws?
Thanks again for all your support and advice. This website is the reason we’re 9 days in to a new and better life. You have probably saved thousands of lives with your work and I am happy to say my bc and I are two of them. 🙂
Best,
J
Jill so sorry for the late response, but your comment went to the spam folder. Ugh! Anyways, I have the problem solved now, but your comment and several others are now getting answered 10-12 days late 🙁 I’m so happy to hear about your progress! And thanks so much for the kind words. As for the kratom, I want you to know that coming off usually leads to some symptoms, however, many readers of this blog have said how well it worked to taper, use supplements, and exercise. I love hearing about these success stories.
As for using it during PAWS, it could work, and it also might delay the process of total healing quickly. It may not delay it though, for instance if you only used it a little, perhaps 1 day per week…not sure though. I want you to know that I use kratom every once in awhile, either to review it, or sometimes I mix it with phenibut or kava just for a relaxing evening. But I don’t abuse it, and I don’t even use it on a weekly basis. I just don’t get addicted to stuff anymore, but other people might have a hard time doing this, while others won’t.
If you and your bf ever have more questions, please feel free to post them or you can even email me at my personal mailbox:
finchy444@yahoo.com
Take care!
Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. This comment is for informational use only. It’s not intended to treat, diagnose or prevent any disease. Always check with your doctor before changing your diet, trying any new supplements, medications, exercise or opiate tapering programs.
Where is the link to order?